It's a Mystery Wrapped in an Enigma

Damnit! This piece-o-crap VectraLIGHT LED license plate frame is driving me crazy! And it cost me $100! :angry2:

I installed the damn thing and it all worked great--running lights, flashing brake light, and turn signals. Then a week later, parts of its functionality start to flicker and disappear. So I fool with the connections. Things are okay again--for awhile.

Then the whole things goes dead. So I re-splice everything, getting rid of the vampire connections and tapping directly into the wires. Presto-chango! It all works beautifully! Till the next friggin' day! So the next chance I get I open the seat, reach in, and without even touching anything--it all works again great! Till the next day when it all goes dark again.

In the mean time my Givi brake kit and of course regular brake and tail lights are working flawlessly.

What in the f*** is up with that thing?

Help!

Jb

JB,

What you describe sounds like an intermittent open - a flaky connection. How is everything connected - taps, or soldering?

The fact that it worked when you pulled the seat tends to lead me to that conclusion. Your stock lights are working - so the first place I would look would be the connections you've added in.

Secondly, I might suspect a ground problem - but it's most likely an open, and most likely on the ground. It's probably the black wire.

Good luck !! Hope you get it fixed soon.

KD

I bet it's the same fuckin' aliens that keep stealing the air outta my tires!

But, I agree with KD. After a weekend of fartin' around with the Wabs' power distribution plate working/not working, I finally traced it to a dicked-up solder job on the grounding tab that I shrink wrapped over and couldn't see.

Damn Enigmas! Can't wait 'til Tracey's book gets here with the secret code!

I was test-driving the connections before soldering, so at this point the long, twisted ends of the LED wires are wrapped tightly around an exposed section of the factory wires, and then (temporarily) electrical-taped. Is it possible that those were bad connections? (See word "tightly" above.) I mean, I know they're not great sparky long-term connections, but shouldn't they connect well enough that I can conclude I have good connections and should search for the problem elsewhere?

James Burleigh said:

I was test-driving the connections before soldering, so at this point the long, twisted ends of the LED wires are wrapped tightly around an exposed section of the factory wires, and then (temporarily) electrical-taped. Is it possible that those were bad connections? (See word "tightly" above.) I mean, I know they're not great sparky long-term connections, but shouldn't they connect well enough that I can conclude I have good connections and should search for the problem elsewhere?

Click to expand...

First rule of troubleshooting:

Always suspect what was done to the bike most recently. Then work backwards.

And electrical tape holding wire around another is kinda like using a sock for a ......... (you fill in the blank)

Any vibration will cause the wires to move against each other - and this confuses the electrons - they just don't know where to go. Floating grounds. bad boogah.

Solder those connections - you can always de-solder if they're incorrect.

You aren't by chance using one of those cold-solder irons, are you? Es No Bueno.

Integrated circuits (IC's) do fail. I would be contacting whomever I bought it from and get it replaced. Then be super careful on the wiring install on number 2.

kaitsdad said:

(snip)Any vibration will cause the wires to move against each other - and this confuses the electrons - they just don't know where to go. Floating grounds. bad boogah. (snip)

Click to expand...

+1 to the floating ground theory. If you really don't want to solder the connections because they are temporary then you might get away with separating the strands of the existing wire and pushing the new wire through that separation. Sort of weaving the two wires together. Then twist. If you're happy with the results then solder them up.

Posi Taps are your friend.

Geezer said:

kaitsdad said:

(snip)Any vibration will cause the wires to move against each other - and this confuses the electrons - they just don't know where to go. Floating grounds. bad boogah. (snip)

Click to expand...

+1 to the floating ground theory. If you really don't want to solder the connections because they are temporary then you might get away with separating the strands of the existing wire and pushing the new wire through that separation. Sort of weaving the two wires together. Then twist. If you're happy with the results then solder them up.

Click to expand...

....and if none of that works, you might condsider finding a good therapist for those confused electrons :huh: :wacko: :blink: :dntknw:

Seriously, though, I totally agree with kaitsdad and Geezer. I'm no electrical expert, but I've learned my lesson the hard way....more than once! Expose unsoldered wires, even ones that are "wrapped tightly", to vibration, and sooner or later you're likely to experience a problem.

toecutter said:

Posi Taps are your friend.

Click to expand...

Ain't no vibrating loose with these babies!

Thanks, all, for your advice. Good stuff. Now it's up to me to get back into the garage, after hitting the hardware store for those PosiTaps.

Jb

Turn the lights to a position where they should be shining, then start wiggling wires, one at a time. See if you can isolate one. Then there is the dreaded broken wire inside the insulation (which you can't see) but the wiggle wire method will sometimes work for that one too.

Ladies and germs, yesterday I went to the hardware store and bought some solder with the rosin core per instructions on this thread (thanks again, all), and last night I went into the garage with a glass of wine, Dr. Dean Edell 150+ reading glasses for the really up-close work, an exacto knife, my cheap-ass soldering iron, and determined alacrity, and being sure to hold my tongue just right, set to work a-soldering....

When I started the job, before removing the manual splices I'd done earlier and electric-taped, the LEDs weren't working at all; nada.

As I set to work, hooking and (successfully) soldering, on came the array, with each function in turn lighting up, as I could see through the mirror leaning against the garage door.

So all seems to be working per Forum recommendations. :clapping:

Thank you again, all!

James ("Sparky") Burleigh

Uhh, Sparky, there IS the matter concerning the lack of payment for advice rendered.. Credit card, pay pal, even cash will be accepted.

dcarver said:

Uhh, Sparky, there IS the matter concerning the lack of payment for advice rendered.. Credit card, pay pal, even cash will be accepted.

Click to expand...

Except it's STILL NOT WORKING!

Okay, this has happened with every %$#@*! wire connecting method I've used: When I first hook it up, it all works great! Then by the end of the next day's riding, kaput! That was true for the original scotch lock vampire connectors, then for the wrap directly and tape, and now for the solder.

The fact that it all lights up at first suggests the accessory is working. What could make it all work, and then all fail so consistently?

F**K!

Jb

As I said before "there are no floating grounds in an electrical system" enough said on that subject.

JB the problem you described seems to indicate a bad ground wire. and that would be where ever you tapped into to make your ground. Go straight to you battery for a safe and secure ground and for proper operation for your new electrical equipment.

That is the most common problem when new wiring is added.

A good volt ohm meter you should be able to find your prpblem.

weekend rider

James Burleigh said:

dcarver said:

Uhh, Sparky, there IS the matter concerning the lack of payment for advice rendered.. Credit card, pay pal, even cash will be accepted.

Click to expand...

Except it's STILL NOT WORKING!

Okay, this has happened with every %$#@*! wire connecting method I've used: When I first hook it up, it all works great! Then by the end of the next day's riding, kaput! That was true for the original scotch lock vampire connectors, then for the wrap directly and tape, and now for the solder.

The fact that it all lights up at first suggests the accessory is working. What could make it all work, and then all fail so consistently?

F**K!

Jb

Click to expand...

Do you have any 'alligator leads' laying around? If not, head down to your local electronics store, get some. Then take the ground of the accessory first to a hard ground, e.g. frame bolt. If that doesn't cut it, go directly back to the battery ground. Anecdotal story; had a Kz1300 giving me horrible spats of problems with an accessory item. Turns out the ground I selected was going through the steering head bearings, at certain rpm's/vibration level, the ground would 'open' and the accessory fail. Of course, it *could* be you have a phooked up unit that gets warm and then opens. If you have same said alligator leads, connect directly to a known good 12 vdc source (battery charger, extra battery etc) and let it stay lit for some time.. See if then fails.

One last thought - did you wire the unit with an in-line fuse? I've had bad luck with poor connections with some of the cheaper fuse holders too. A little vibration, and darkness.

Either that or you should have had white wine, not red wine for the fixin' session.

All right.... Take a DEEEEEEEEP breath. Blow out. In... Out.....

Okay. I'm calm now. :calm:

I will play with my ground some more, and when I'm through playing with that I'll play with the one on the motorcycle and take your advice. Stay tuned....

[And speaking of playing with my ground, that reminds me of the other thread about wrist fatigue. Boy, is my wrist fatigued! Test rode the Shiny-Hiney route today in Marin County. Long day. Great ride. Beautiful vistas. I can't wait to share it next weekend!]

Jb

EDIT P.S. So, I have the accessory ground wire now soldered into the black factory brake-harness wire. To test the ground hypothesis, can I just run another wire to the solder point as a "second" ground? Or should I cut the accessory ground wire from the factory harness and run the accessory ground fresh to a "better" ground?

JB to see if that is the problem just run a tempory ground wire to your battery and check it that way. Even ride it with the remp wire and see if your problemis cured.

I do not recomend cutting into your original harness wiring.

Take your lights off and hook them up seperately and see if they work, A way to prove if its the lights or wiring.

One other point your wire that carries the power for the lights should be its own and not tied in to the existing wiring harness at any point.

The wiring harness's wires are sized for that piece of electrical it is to run