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Broke the fuel line fitting on fuel pump


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#1 Charlie Hoss

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Posted 17 March 2012 - 04:39 PM

I put in a request for a fuel pump or flange under "Wanted" but think I may get better exposure over here. I was doing the valve check/CCT replacement, started bike to check for leaks from coolant pipe. O-ring on one side didn't seal, had a hard time getting one fuel fitting and one electrical connector loose from tank to remove again, so I just slid it back on the frame for more working room. It seemed to be solid :unsure: . Can you see where this is going? After a few minutes, the tank (with a half tank of gas) took a swan dive off the bike, landed upside down on the concrete floor :cray: . It has a couple of small to moderate dents and the expected road rash, but it also broke the nylon fitting the gas line was attached to and ripped the wires out of one of the electrical connectors. I was able to get the contacts out of the connector, resolder the wires and put it all back together. Now I need the pump flange which is replaceable but not available as a separate part. The nylon fitting is moulded into the flange. There are a few very pricey pumps on Ebay but I thought I'd try here first. I think the tank can be fixed at a body shop, otherwise it's over $700 for a new one.

BTW, I just finished reading "The Fuel Pump Wars" by RadioHowie on this forum. Awesome!
IBA # 24570
Previously owned:
'88 Venture Royale, '82 CBX (wish I had that bad boy back!), '80 XS1100, '76 Wing, '70 CB750, '70 KAW MachIII, '58 (?) 250 Harley Sprint, '57 175 DKW, '60 Sears CruiseAire.
Current: '75 RD200, '86 500 Shadow, just added-07 ZX14.

#2 Panman

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Posted 17 March 2012 - 05:32 PM

I have never liked taking that fitting apart! I feel feel for you, me I'd be kicking my self for awhile. I hate lessons learned!
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#3 PhilJet09

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Posted 18 March 2012 - 07:08 AM

I can't help with the procurement of a fuel pump flange, but I bet Gerauld could fix your rashed up tank for ya.
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#4 fudgejerkin1188

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Posted 18 March 2012 - 09:46 AM

Do you need a flange with a single or double pipe fitting ? I've an early flange you could have but it off a UK bike and has a single outlet.
Part number 5JW-13907-00. Should't cost much to post from the UK as it a light item if its any good.

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Having re read you post I think its the flange with two pipes you want .

Edited by fudgejerkin1188, 18 March 2012 - 09:48 AM.

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#5 RossKean

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Posted 18 March 2012 - 02:03 PM

Charlie

That really sucks! Sounds like something I might do. Good luck in finding a flange, pump or whole tank assembly!! I would suggest trying a fuel-proof epoxy to attach it but wouldn't want to be riding your bike if the repair failed, dumping raw fuel over a hot engine. That would REALLY ruin your day.

Ross

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#6 RadioHowie

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Posted 18 March 2012 - 03:54 PM

Unless someone with charity in their heart, and a Gen 1 fuel pump flange in their hands steps up, here's a suggestion:

PM fudgejerkin1188 for his Gen 2 flange, then check out Joe2lMaker's post HERE where for a minimal price, you can duplicate the Gen 1 flange with Joe2lMakers fine fuel line fitting.

It's worth a shot!! Otherwise, good luck.
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#7 Charlie Hoss

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Posted 18 March 2012 - 04:41 PM

Do you need a flange with a single or double pipe fitting ? I've an early flange you could have but it off a UK bike and has a single outlet.
Part number 5JW-13907-00. Should't cost much to post from the UK as it a light item if its any good.

Posted Image

Having re read you post I think its the flange with two pipes you want .


Thanks fj1188. It is the two pipe fitting unit. I may have to do as RadioHowie suggested above.
IBA # 24570
Previously owned:
'88 Venture Royale, '82 CBX (wish I had that bad boy back!), '80 XS1100, '76 Wing, '70 CB750, '70 KAW MachIII, '58 (?) 250 Harley Sprint, '57 175 DKW, '60 Sears CruiseAire.
Current: '75 RD200, '86 500 Shadow, just added-07 ZX14.

#8 Charlie Hoss

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Posted 18 March 2012 - 04:46 PM

Unless someone with charity in their heart, and a Gen 1 fuel pump flange in their hands steps up, here's a suggestion:

PM fudgejerkin1188 for his Gen 2 flange, then check out Joe2lMaker's post HERE where for a minimal price, you can duplicate the Gen 1 flange with Joe2lMakers fine fuel line fitting.

It's worth a shot!! Otherwise, good luck.



RH,
I read that thread from beginning to end looking for info on taking this thing apart. I'll definitely read it again. It should work if I can't find the right part.
Thanks, Charlie
IBA # 24570
Previously owned:
'88 Venture Royale, '82 CBX (wish I had that bad boy back!), '80 XS1100, '76 Wing, '70 CB750, '70 KAW MachIII, '58 (?) 250 Harley Sprint, '57 175 DKW, '60 Sears CruiseAire.
Current: '75 RD200, '86 500 Shadow, just added-07 ZX14.

#9 Charlie Hoss

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Posted 18 March 2012 - 04:57 PM

I can't help with the procurement of a fuel pump flange, but I bet Gerauld could fix your rashed up tank for ya.



Yeah, I know he could. I had him powdercoat a Givi rack a few years ago. He does excellent work for a very fair price. I'm thinking local only because I may have 3 pieces that could use fresh paint...you know, shipping costs as well as turn around time. I suppose I could just keep my tank bag on there all the time and it wouldn't be very noticeable, then send the parts to him next winter.
IBA # 24570
Previously owned:
'88 Venture Royale, '82 CBX (wish I had that bad boy back!), '80 XS1100, '76 Wing, '70 CB750, '70 KAW MachIII, '58 (?) 250 Harley Sprint, '57 175 DKW, '60 Sears CruiseAire.
Current: '75 RD200, '86 500 Shadow, just added-07 ZX14.

#10 Charlie Hoss

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Posted 18 March 2012 - 04:59 PM

I can't help with the procurement of a fuel pump flange, but I bet Gerauld could fix your rashed up tank for ya.



Yeah, I know he could. I had him powdercoat a Givi rack a few years ago. He does excellent work for a very fair price. I'm thinking local only because I may have 3 pieces that could use fresh paint...you know, shipping costs as well as turn around time. I suppose I could just keep my tank bag on there all the time and it wouldn't be very noticeable, then send the parts to him next winter.
IBA # 24570
Previously owned:
'88 Venture Royale, '82 CBX (wish I had that bad boy back!), '80 XS1100, '76 Wing, '70 CB750, '70 KAW MachIII, '58 (?) 250 Harley Sprint, '57 175 DKW, '60 Sears CruiseAire.
Current: '75 RD200, '86 500 Shadow, just added-07 ZX14.

#11 Joe2Lmaker

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 04:30 PM

Unless someone with charity in their heart, and a Gen 1 fuel pump flange in their hands steps up, here's a suggestion:

PM fudgejerkin1188 for his Gen 2 flange, then check out Joe2lMaker's post HERE where for a minimal price, you can duplicate the Gen 1 flange with Joe2lMakers fine fuel line fitting.

It's worth a shot!! Otherwise, good luck.

I noticed this thread and I wish I could offer assistance.

My fitting will convert a GenI flange for use as a GenII flange with an auxiliary fitting. If you need a GenI fuel pump flange, my set-up would need to be reverted to the original configuration. Sorry.

That said... It is possible to machine a GenII flange to accept a GenI fitting (I have two OEM fittings I'm not using), but this would not be the easiest solution. IOW a PITA

One last note, all of these these parts are acetal/POM/Delrin
Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted ImagePosted Image

#12 RossKean

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 04:47 PM

Had a quick look on-line and the best price I found was $389

(Don't know anything about these guys)

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#13 fudgejerkin1188

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:38 AM

Charlie,
It here if you need it. Its actually a European Gen 1 fuel pump flange. I'll keep an eye open for an early Euro gen 2 pump

Tim
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#14 HotRodZilla

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:58 AM

There has to be a ton of motorcycle salvage yards with FJRs that still have this part intact. Unless you have come up with something better, I'd start looking there.

I'd be so pissed if I had done that. Dayum.

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#15 Charlie Hoss

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:53 PM


Unless someone with charity in their heart, and a Gen 1 fuel pump flange in their hands steps up, here's a suggestion:

PM fudgejerkin1188 for his Gen 2 flange, then check out Joe2lMaker's post HERE where for a minimal price, you can duplicate the Gen 1 flange with Joe2lMakers fine fuel line fitting.

It's worth a shot!! Otherwise, good luck.

I noticed this thread and I wish I could offer assistance.

My fitting will convert a GenI flange for use as a GenII flange with an auxiliary fitting. If you need a GenI fuel pump flange, my set-up would need to be reverted to the original configuration. Sorry.

That said... It is possible to machine a GenII flange to accept a GenI fitting (I have two OEM fittings I'm not using), but this would not be the easiest solution. IOW a PITA

One last note, all of these these parts are acetal/POM/Delrin



Joe2Lmaker,

The fuel pump flange that fudgejerkin is offering looks like it would work if the "dummy" moulding where the hole would be for a 2 pipe set-up was drilled out properly to accept the return elbow. I assume the lock tabs are moulded in on the inside of the flange. If I sent you the one that fj is offering plus my broken flange, could you remove the old return elbow and drill out fj's unit to accept it?
IBA # 24570
Previously owned:
'88 Venture Royale, '82 CBX (wish I had that bad boy back!), '80 XS1100, '76 Wing, '70 CB750, '70 KAW MachIII, '58 (?) 250 Harley Sprint, '57 175 DKW, '60 Sears CruiseAire.
Current: '75 RD200, '86 500 Shadow, just added-07 ZX14.

#16 fudgejerkin1188

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 06:53 AM

Charlie
The locking tabs are already moulded to the fixing, it does look like your idea may work if someone has the correct tools and skill to machine the fixing.

Posted Image

Posted Image

PM me your address and I'll send it anyway.

Tim
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#17 Joe2Lmaker

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:42 AM

You want your broken flange installed into fudgejerkin1188's modified flange?
I think you'd be better off with one of these:
Posted Image
I removed it from a GenI Fuel pump flange madmike2 gave me.

You can have the leftover GenI fitting sans the "O" ring. I'm using the "O" ring in my GenII but you might be able to reuse the "O" ring from your broken fitting. Or, at least you can get the dimensions from it to buy a new one.

Modifying the GenII flange could be done, but it would require some time. The mold which produces these parts has a component called an "insert" which can be substituted for another. I would need to have both flanges so I could figure out how much material to remove. It would be more complicated than simply running a drill through there. In order for those locking tabs to function properly, I'm pretty sure the material removed would need to be conical. You won't be able to buy a reamer in the correct shape. That leaves making a cutter with the correct taper, or programming a conical path for a CNC mill.

It can be done. But like I posted earlier, it's not the easiest solution.
Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted ImagePosted Image

#18 Charlie Hoss

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 09:32 AM

You want your broken flange installed into fudgejerkin1188's modified flange?
I think you'd be better off with one of these:
Posted Image
I removed it from a GenI Fuel pump flange madmike2 gave me.

You can have the leftover GenI fitting sans the "O" ring. I'm using the "O" ring in my GenII but you might be able to reuse the "O" ring from your broken fitting. Or, at least you can get the dimensions from it to buy a new one.

Modifying the GenII flange could be done, but it would require some time. The mold which produces these parts has a component called an "insert" which can be substituted for another. I would need to have both flanges so I could figure out how much material to remove. It would be more complicated than simply running a drill through there. In order for those locking tabs to function properly, I'm pretty sure the material removed would need to be conical. You won't be able to buy a reamer in the correct shape. That leaves making a cutter with the correct taper, or programming a conical path for a CNC mill.

It can be done. But like I posted earlier, it's not the easiest solution.



Joe,

The piece you show in your post is not the broken one. The broken fitting is the longer one with the locking ring in the center, I pretty sure it's the high pressure side. The piece you show is in good condition on my flange and is the one I could provide if you could make it adapt to fj1188's early model flange which doesn't have a fuel return line. Sorry about the lack of pictures, I never quite mastered getting them on the forum posts, but I could e-mail them to you if it would help.

Thanks for helping,
Charlie
IBA # 24570
Previously owned:
'88 Venture Royale, '82 CBX (wish I had that bad boy back!), '80 XS1100, '76 Wing, '70 CB750, '70 KAW MachIII, '58 (?) 250 Harley Sprint, '57 175 DKW, '60 Sears CruiseAire.
Current: '75 RD200, '86 500 Shadow, just added-07 ZX14.

#19 Charlie Hoss

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 09:37 AM

Charlie
The locking tabs are already moulded to the fixing, it does look like your idea may work if someone has the correct tools and skill to machine the fixing.

Posted Image

Posted Image

PM me your address and I'll send it anyway.

Tim



Tim,

Thanks so much for your generosity. I'll be happy to pay you for the part and particularly for the postage. If I find that I can't use it, I will pass it along to the next guy who can. PM is on the way.

Charlie
IBA # 24570
Previously owned:
'88 Venture Royale, '82 CBX (wish I had that bad boy back!), '80 XS1100, '76 Wing, '70 CB750, '70 KAW MachIII, '58 (?) 250 Harley Sprint, '57 175 DKW, '60 Sears CruiseAire.
Current: '75 RD200, '86 500 Shadow, just added-07 ZX14.

#20 RadioHowie

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 10:04 AM

Charlie,

There's an '04 pump on eBay right now (HERE) for $140.

Considering what these things go for new, that's not a bad price at all. Considering the hell you're going through, it could be a quick way out of your problem. And since all you need is the base flange, you could probably sell the rest of the pump back to someone on the forum fairly easily.
"Screw you guys....I'm going home riding!" Darksider #15
The whole chicken strips thing is BS. - HaulinAshe 7/29/2010
Man, there's a lot of info here if I just shut my pie hole and read. -- madmatt 8/5/2010