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Stripped engine right side engine / slider?


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#1 43Duc

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:04 PM

Decided to install a a pigtail to my battery today and after removing the cover decided to go ahead and remove the right side faring to replace a screw that was missing from the "v" cowling. In order to do that I need to remove the frame slider because the fairing won't clear it due to it's design. I just got this bike two weeks ago and it came w/ the frame sliders - bike's an 09.

Anyway, as I'm loosening the slider bolt it starts to get harder and harder to remove. Panic set in and I decided that I must be doing something wrong (although I've never had that happen w/ sliders or engine bolts on previous bikes). I decided to stop and re-torque the slider and worry about the cowling later. As I'm trying to re-tighten the bolt it tightens up to the point where it can't go any tighter without fear of shearing off the bolt. I know it's not all the way in because the slider and spacer are loose. I fear that I've royally screwed up. Anyone able to confirm? At this point I'm planning on taking it to the dealer and bending over.
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#2 JamesK

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:32 PM

Sorry to say, but it sounds like the thread is already stripped. I'd say the reason it's tightening up in either direction is because the lose bits of the stripped thread are getting caught up in the still remaining parts of the threads.

All is not lost since this is an easily accessible location and does not require much dis-assembly so a Timesert would be able to fix the problem. For this kind of higher torque application I would strongly advise using Timeserts vs. Helicoil. Depending on how big a jerk your local stealer is though you should definitely bring lots of Vaseline though :rolleyes:

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#3 kaitsdad

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:50 PM

OK - Not really a problem. The right side mount bolt that is commonly used for the slider screws into what Yamaha calls a "collar" and can easily be obtained from Partshark, etc., for about 10 bucks. The collar is held in place in the frame by a pinch bolt that is easily accessible with the plastic off. So - timesert not necessary, it's an easy-peasy fix.

The collar is used for adjustable spacing in order to properly align the drive train in the frame.

I don't know if this link will work - but let's see what happens: Hope this works
(It's Item #15 in the "frame" fiche.)

If it doesn't, the part number is: COLLAR 90387-1312P-00

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#4 SkooterG

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:04 PM

Nice job Hal!!!
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#5 43Duc

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:45 PM

If I loosen the pinch bolt enough, will the entire assembly (slider, bolt, collar) come out? As it is I can't get the fairing off due to the shape of slider. I can loosen the pinch bolt once the panel is loosened and pulled out a bit. Otherwise, how best do I get the collar out w/ the bolt fused to it?

I appreciate the help!
-chris
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#6 kaitsdad

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 12:10 AM

If I loosen the pinch bolt enough, will the entire assembly (slider, bolt, collar) come out? As it is I can't get the fairing off due to the shape of slider. I can loosen the pinch bolt once the panel is loosened and pulled out a bit. Otherwise, how best do I get the collar out w/ the bolt fused to it?

I appreciate the help!
-chris



While I've never tried it, you should be able to remove the bolt & collar by loosening the pinch bolt. Loosen the pinch bolt, the collar should just pull out. Take note of how the collar is aligned in the frame, I'd suggest marking it, then measuring so that you can ensure the same clearances on the new collar.

Let us know how it goes.

I see you're in So Cal. as am I. You can PM me if you get stuck. I'll try to help.

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#7 wheatonFJR

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 03:56 AM

^^^^^ This dude is one of the reasons why this forum rocks!

#8 LAF

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 04:05 AM

If I loosen the pinch bolt enough, will the entire assembly (slider, bolt, collar) come out? As it is I can't get the fairing off due to the shape of slider. I can loosen the pinch bolt once the panel is loosened and pulled out a bit. Otherwise, how best do I get the collar out w/ the bolt fused to it?

I appreciate the help!
-chris

There is enough room to slide extensions with a swivel from the front by the radiator and the cowing. I do it all the time on my 10 as the slider must come off to strip the bike. Another 10 thing I found out when I bought the bike.

Also I learned a long time ago if I am turning a bolt out if it gets hard to turn I go back in a few turns and back out a bit and repeat.

I am also nuts as I wire brush every bolt I take out before it goes back in. Seems dissimilar metals have a tendency to form a corrosion.

#9 yamafitter

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 04:37 AM

... Seems dissimilar metals have a tendency to form a corrosion.

The term for this is electrolysis and one of the ways to avoid this from happening is to coat the threads with an anti-seize compound like Never-Seez. Using lubricants on the bolts does have an effect on torque settings but I still use the same torque setting as quoted in the manual and my motor has not fallen out of the frame yet. The bolt holding the slider on will need to come off for a number of maintenance tasks such as valve checks so I would recommend the use of an anti-seize compound in this case.
Also is not the collar that Hal speaks of is basically a spacer and is not threaded? I thought the threads are in the engine case in which case the threads will need to be repaired with a timesert.
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#10 43Duc

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 06:13 AM

It seems to me by looking at it that the bolt goes through the collar and then into the threaded engine bolt hole. If that's the case I don't think loosening the pinch bolt will allow me to remove the bolt.

I did try the back in and back out a bit method, but it got harder each time and is now completely seized up. I'm very frustrated and am thinking I'll just take it to the dealer and not risk screwing it up even more.

I'm just gutted over the whole thing as I bought this bike with hopes that this kind of thing wasn't going to happen (at least not two weeks into it). Part of the sales pitch to the wife to get this bike was I was tired of wrenching on my Ducati and Ninja and the subsequent down time. Obviously I'm now paying for the previous owner not using any type of anti-seize when installing these sliders.
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#11 xcsp

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 07:12 AM

Here's a good anti-seize product from Motorex:

http://motorexusa.co...etail.asp?id=50

I like using this rather than the Permatex gray, easier to use IMHO.

For most applications, I just spray small amount on paper or cardboard and use a q-tip (cotton swap)to apply.
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#12 kaitsdad

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 08:12 AM

It seems to me by looking at it that the bolt goes through the collar and then into the threaded engine bolt hole. If that's the case I don't think loosening the pinch bolt will allow me to remove the bolt.

I did try the back in and back out a bit method, but it got harder each time and is now completely seized up. I'm very frustrated and am thinking I'll just take it to the dealer and not risk screwing it up even more.

I'm just gutted over the whole thing as I bought this bike with hopes that this kind of thing wasn't going to happen (at least not two weeks into it). Part of the sales pitch to the wife to get this bike was I was tired of wrenching on my Ducati and Ninja and the subsequent down time. Obviously I'm now paying for the previous owner not using any type of anti-seize when installing these sliders.

I think you're right - in studying the fiche it does appear that the collar is just a spacer. Sorry for the mis-direct. I wonder if the bolts provided with the sliders are the correct thread?

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#13 RadioHowie

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 08:15 AM

OK - Not really a problem. The right side mount bolt that is commonly used for the slider screws into what Yamaha calls a "collar" and can easily be obtained from Partshark, etc., for about 10 bucks. The collar is held in place in the frame by a pinch bolt that is easily accessible with the plastic off. So - timesert not necessary, it's an easy-peasy fix.


Sorry, but that's not correct. The bolt screws into a lug on the engine block on the right side just like it does on the left side. The collar is simply a spacer that allows the mechanic to torque the bolt correctly to the motor, then the pinch bolts in the frame hold the collar correctly in place.

If there are threads screwed up, because of electrolysis or hamfistedness, the repair must take place on the lug on the engine block, and Timesert is most definitely a better choice than Helicoil, due to the amount of torque necessary.

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edit: I see Hal retracted his post while I was writing mine.
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#14 dcarver

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 08:20 AM

Confirmed the collar is just a spacer with no threads.
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#15 HotRodZilla

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 08:28 AM

What kind of slider is installed on your bike? I have the OES sliders and take my fairings off all the time without taking the sliders off. They will fit between the space in the fairing with just a little gentle motivation.

I also wouldn't blame the use/non-use of antiseize. Mine don't have any and have gone in and out just fine. Maybe cross-threaded or just torqued way too tight. Whatever it was, I think you're hosed and will have to Timesert the mount. It'll be stronger when it's finished anyways.

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#16 43Duc

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 09:57 AM

The sliders are GCG Mototechniks. They look like this:

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The mushroom of the top of the slider keeps it from clearing the fairing. I tried to use gentle persuasion but it was taking a lot more than I was comfortable giving it. I thought it would be easier to remove and re-torque after repairing the fairing. I was wrong.

I just got back from dropping the bike off at the shop. Their main tech is off until tomorrow and they don't want any of their tire jockey's to mess with it. I'd prefer they wait for the other guy... he's done a lot of work on my dirt bike and I trust him. I'll keep you all posted to the outcome.
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#17 SkooterG

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 10:04 AM

Bummer man. Hopefully this will be the last *snafu* you encounter with your new baby.

On the Gen I FJRs, the most popular type of slider uses a triangular bracket that mounts to two frame bolts. Then the slider mounts to that bracket. What is nice about this set-up is that every time you have to remove the slider to get the plastic off, you are removing the slider bolt from that bracket, and not the engine/frame.
IBA #327........................ Darksider #52

FJR#1 - The 'Dirty Ol Whore' - 2004 non-abs - RIP @ 226,400 - Gone, but not forgotton.
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FJR#3 - The 'Virgin' - 2004 ABS - 4344 miles, a garage queen - Brundog would be proud!
FJR#4 - The Oregon FJR - 2004 ABS - 65k
FJR#5 - The Bastard POS Gen II - 2009A - 42k

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#18 43Duc

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 10:22 AM

Bummer man. Hopefully this will be the last *snafu* you encounter with your new baby.


Thanks, I hope so too. I've got other projects that I'd rather be working on. It's not that I'm not mechanically inclined, it's just that I just want to thumb the starter and go! My recent projects were this:

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To this:

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And this:

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To this:

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The red one requires a lot more time, money and work. I'd like to get back to it!
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#19 Burnspot

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 12:14 PM

I still love what you did to that old Jeep. :D

Hopefully, this incident is the last one you'll see for awhile!

#20 Geezer

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 01:31 PM

I think you're right - in studying the fiche it does appear that the collar is just a spacer. Sorry for the mis-direct. I wonder if the bolts provided with the sliders are the correct thread?


I recall a thread from a couple or more years back where someone verified that the bolts that came with certain sliders did NOT have the correct thread pitch for the engine mount holes that they threaded into and several people stripped theirs after repeated removal and replace instances.
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