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FJRF004: The 2006/7 Altitude Fix


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#221 Mr_Canoehead

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Posted 26 January 2017 - 01:17 PM

Yes, there are a couple of mountain passes that I ride that cause the issue every time...I'll call Yamaha and see what they say. Thanks for the input.

 

I'd be interested in getting the part number off of the new ECU if you have it available.


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#222 ERS

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Posted 29 January 2017 - 04:27 PM

Canoehead,

 

Had to remove my ECU to get the part#.

 

The number stamped on the replacement ECU is FUA0011   3P6-33   F8T83374 . The part # on the box it came in is 90891-30055 FJR1300 ECU kit,

 

The number on my original ECU is FUA0011    3P6-31    F8T83374

 

I got the replacement in 2012 and my bike is a Canadian 2006 with immobilizer.

 

Hope this helps



#223 Mr_Canoehead

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Posted 31 January 2017 - 01:57 PM

To update the thread, in case anyone needs it down the road, I have the same "before" part as ERS: 3P6-31

 

I spoke to Yamaha Canada and they said that there was a service bulletin issued in Canada (no recall) but it expired in Dec 2015. I tried for a goodwill extension but no dice. Bastards.banghead.gif  rtfm.gif

 

Yamaha confirmed that the "ECU kit" number that ERS posted (90891-30055) is correct for a 2006 with immobilizer and that the part is still available for $375 CDN, which is more than I wanted but less than I expected to spend, given the prices on various online fiches list an ECU at around $1k CDN.

 

It's cheaper than plan B which was to buy a newer bike and trade the farkles over and I wouldn't be comfortable selling the bike knowing that it behaves badly at inopportune times.


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#224 Darmah

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Posted 31 January 2017 - 05:53 PM

I live in the low country and never knew I had an issue till the Blue Ridge Parkway. The higher I went the worse it go. An almost identical FJR was with me but a couple of years newer and never had a problem. Got back home, went to dealer, yep my bike was part of the recall. All of sudden Yamaha decided that this recall was over and I would have to pay for the parts myself, WHAAAAT, you have got to be kidding. Called Yamaha customer service myself and made it clear this was not acceptable, amazingly they came up with special clause number XYZ and now it is covered.

 

Back to dealer, he insists that Yamaha says he has to test drive the bike to verify the issue. We live at 400' MSL and the issue only happens above 4000', so whats the point. Nope he has to test drive it. OK, turn over the keys and find out the serviceghuy cant figure out how to ride my AE, well that gives me a lot of confidence.

 

Anyway after 4 weeks of BS it was fixed and a $100 problem has now turned into a $1000 of wasted time and one semi-pissed off long time customer.

 

Never ceases to amaze me how stupid some people and companies have become.



I live in the low country and never knew I had an issue till the Blue Ridge Parkway. The higher I went the worse it go. An almost identical FJR was with me but a couple of years newer and never had a problem. Got back home, went to dealer, yep my bike was part of the recall. All of sudden Yamaha decided that this recall was over and I would have to pay for the parts myself, WHAAAAT, you have got to be kidding. Called Yamaha customer service myself and made it clear this was not acceptable, amazingly they came up with special clause number XYZ and now it is covered.

 

Back to dealer, he insists that Yamaha says he has to test drive the bike to verify the issue. We live at 400' MSL and the issue only happens above 4000', so whats the point. Nope he has to test drive it. OK, turn over the keys and find out the serviceghuy cant figure out how to ride my AE, well that gives me a lot of confidence.

 

Anyway after 4 weeks of BS it was fixed and a $100 problem has now turned into a $1000 of wasted time and one semi-pissed off long time customer.

 

Never ceases to amaze me how stupid some people and companies have become.



#225 HotRodZilla

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Posted 31 January 2017 - 06:02 PM

Since you are still "other or considering FJR," I'm gong to assume you bought yours used. When you did that, you didn't bother to call a dealer and check on the status of any recalls or service bulletins that may affect your bike? Sorry, but you bear a lot of culpability for the problem Yamaha just fixed for you for free, nearly 10 years after the fact.

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#226 Mr_Canoehead

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Posted 31 January 2017 - 07:03 PM

I have a US spec "ECU kit" that I bought last summer hoping it would fix my problem but it won't work with my immobilizer. If someone needs it, let me know. Might be easier than fighting with an uncooperative dealer or the mothership.

 

When I bought my bike in 2013, I did check for recalls (all were done) but I didn't ask about "Service Bulletins". I didn't even think about them and I am pretty tech savvy. I did read about the issue here (and another FJR owner friend/member here warned me about the issue) but I didn't put two and two together until last summer. My bad and $400 to fix it isn't gonna break me. I will keep it in mind next time I buy a bike, though.

 

I find it interesting that BramFrank couldn't get Yamaha Canada to admit to the problem way back in 2011 but ERS got it done in 2012. Sounds like they only acknowledged the issue in 2012.

 

Since Yamaha Canada is much smaller than Yamaha USA and seems to have different recalls and service bulletins, the recalls and bulletins don't always line up. Knowing about service bulletins saved me $$$ on repairs on my Mazdaspeed but Mazda Canada and USA have the same system. Now that Yamaha Canada has been rolled into the US operation, that situation should be improved. Hopefully the guy who made it a service bulletin rather than a recall lost his job in the merger.

 

I also bought the bike from a close friend who had it serviced at the dealer for the first 7 years of its life and never seems to have noticed the problem - and he was pretty tech savvy, too. It was certainly never mentioned in any of the work orders that he gave me and he never mentioned it on our trips over the years, when he was riding this bike. Unfortunately, he passed away last year, so I'll never know for sure. I'm pretty sure if he knew about it, he would have raised hell with Yamaha and would have mentioned it.


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#227 RossKean

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Posted 31 January 2017 - 07:40 PM

The thing to remember is that this is not a fix to make it run better at altitude but a fix to enable the fuel system to adapt to CHANGES in elevation. It will still adapt to an elevation change with the old ECU but it doesn't resample air pressure or fuel mix unless there is a significant change in throttle position (1/4 turn?) or cycling the ignition. With the new ECU, it will react to a smaller throttle movement.
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#228 HotRodZilla

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Posted 31 January 2017 - 07:57 PM

All the update did was change the needed throttle input from 1/4 turn to 1/8 turn. Before my dealer just did it during a service, I never experienced a problem, and I have huge elevation changes here. I still don't understand how some of you ride far enough up a mountain to cause air sampling issues, without turning the throttle 1/4 turn.

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#229 Queensland Ken

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 07:43 AM

Yamaha didn't recall any of the Aussie bikes, wasn't a recall and I spent heaps of $$$$ to rectify the fault and prove it.

Finally a few years after and many complaints a great dealer swapped out the ECU and all was fixed, perfect fuelling.

Ended up selling the Autotune, PC5 and my LCD200 that I used to tune and data log the fault.


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#230 ERS

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 10:29 AM

Canadians were covered by this bulletin as far back as 2009, Attached is a link to an old thread where several Canucks had different stories from their dealers. but most got the updated ECU.

 

 

http://www.fjrforum....-07-fjrs/page-2

 

FWIW

 

Rick



#231 Mr_Canoehead

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 12:36 PM

All the update did was change the needed throttle input from 1/4 turn to 1/8 turn. Before my dealer just did it during a service, I never experienced a problem, and I have huge elevation changes here. I still don't understand how some of you ride far enough up a mountain to cause air sampling issues, without turning the throttle 1/4 turn.

It's not going up, it's going downhill that causes the issue for me - I ride some roads where you can drop a few thousand feet steeply enough to never go over 1/4 throttle. This makes the bike go crazy lean - since the bike runs lean anyway, it goes into a lean misfire.I really noticed this riding in California this summer. Even if you did go uphill at low throttle, the ability of the engine to handle a rich mixture is much better than a lean one.

 

Over a two week trip through the CA mountains, I did try a few things:

 

1) blipping the throttle occasionally to >50% with the clutch pulled in

2) hitting the kill switch and holding the throttle WFO while coasting downhill every few minutes

 

What I found was that once the bike started running badly, neither of these actions would fix the issue. Only a key off restart would fix it; but if I did one of these two occasionally before the issue was noticeable, the problem wouldn't appear. I suspect that once it started misbehaving, it had already run off the map and couldn't correct itself. A friend (and member here) reported exactly the same behavior on his 2007 in Colorado. YMMV

 

Canadians were covered by this bulletin as far back as 2009, Attached is a link to an old thread where several Canucks had different stories from their dealers. but most got the updated ECU.

 Yet at the top of this page, BramFrank had his dealer and Yamaha insist there was no such bulletin in 2011.....As I said, my friend (and PO of my bike) may have complained and got the same answer as BamFrank but AFAIK, he never noticed the problem. Considering how cautious a rider he was, I doubt he was always over 25% throttle. We once got passed uphill in the mountains by a Westphalia camper when he was leading!

 

I actually wondered if the Canadian bikes just didn't have the issue because the ECU is a different part - but Yamaha Canada obviously did the "Don't ask, don't tell" approach. With the info provided by ERS and my description of the symptoms, they acknowledged the issue immediately - but of course, now they are off the hook financially.


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#232 ERS

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 02:48 PM

If you check the thread I linked, bramfrank claimed in a post in 2009 there that he was eligible for the ECU but says he refused the replacement. His post above doesn't jive with what he said in 2009. 

 

It looks like Yamaha Canada only responded to owners who made a complaint based on experiencing the issue or in my case having the potential to experience it.    



#233 HotRodZilla

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 06:21 PM

All the update did was change the needed throttle input from 1/4 turn to 1/8 turn. Before my dealer just did it during a service, I never experienced a problem, and I have huge elevation changes here. I still don't understand how some of you ride far enough up a mountain to cause air sampling issues, without turning the throttle 1/4 turn.

It's not going up, it's going downhill that causes the issue for me - I ride some roads where you can drop a few thousand feet steeply enough to never go over 1/4 throttle. This makes the bike go crazy lean - since the bike runs lean anyway, it goes into a lean misfire.I really noticed this riding in California this summer. Even if you did go uphill at low throttle, the ability of the engine to handle a rich mixture is much better than a lean one.
 
Over a two week trip through the CA mountains, I did try a few things:
 
1) blipping the throttle occasionally to >50% with the clutch pulled in
2) hitting the kill switch and holding the throttle WFO while coasting downhill every few minutes
 
What I found was that once the bike started running badly, neither of these actions would fix the issue. Only a key off restart would fix it; but if I did one of these two occasionally before the issue was noticeable, the problem wouldn't appear. I suspect that once it started misbehaving, it had already run off the map and couldn't correct itself. A friend (and member here) reported exactly the same behavior on his 2007 in Colorado. YMMV
 

Canadians were covered by this bulletin as far back as 2009, Attached is a link to an old thread where several Canucks had different stories from their dealers. but most got the updated ECU.

 Yet at the top of this page, BramFrank had his dealer and Yamaha insist there was no such bulletin in 2011.....As I said, my friend (and PO of my bike) may have complained and got the same answer as BamFrank but AFAIK, he never noticed the problem. Considering how cautious a rider he was, I doubt he was always over 25% throttle. We once got passed uphill in the mountains by a Westphalia camper when he was leading!
 
I actually wondered if the Canadian bikes just didn't have the issue because the ECU is a different part - but Yamaha Canada obviously did the "Don't ask, don't tell" approach. With the info provided by ERS and my description of the symptoms, they acknowledged the issue immediately - but of course, now they are off the hook financially.


Honestly, after all this time, you're the first one to ever answer that with a reasonable answer. Guess I hadn't thought about that and thought the bike would go FUBAR on the way down. Makes perfect sense. I'll admit we don't have long straight drops like that around here. Ours usually have turns that require engine braking, shifting, and throttle movement.

Thanks!!

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#234 BkerChuck

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 03:53 AM

FWIW, when I bought my '07 in August of 2012 I did contact a local dealer and found out abut the recalls and bulletins. Living where I do in PA we have no elevations of 4k or higher and the dealership told me the ECU update wasn't necessary where we live. I really didn't think much about it at the time. Fast forward a little over a year and a trip to the Dragon and Great Smokey Mountains. Wow did I ever notice a problem! Called dealership while on vacation and insisted I wanted the upgrade. They ordered an ECU and installed it right after I came home. I did note that if we stopped at a scenic overlook that after we left the bike ran better but I didn't put 2 + 2 together until later that it was cycling the ignition that was helping.


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#235 Mr_Canoehead

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Posted 03 April 2017 - 08:26 PM

If anyone has a 2006 or 2007 USA spec bike and needs the updated ECU, drop me a line. I have one that I purchased but it wouldn't work on my Canadian model.


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#236 ajpagosa

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 08:12 AM

All the update did was change the needed throttle input from 1/4 turn to 1/8 turn. Before my dealer just did it during a service, I never experienced a problem, and I have huge elevation changes here. I still don't understand how some of you ride far enough up a mountain to cause air sampling issues, without turning the throttle 1/4 turn.

 

I know this is the common legend but I don't think it is correct, or at least not the full story.  If it were true one blip of the throttle past 1/4 turn would always fix it, and it did not.  Ever.  There is some moving average or cumulative buffer that over time if not corrected enough gets too far off and the bike stumbles/stalls or becomes dangerously un-ridable, uphill or downhill.  No amount of blipping the throttle fixes it after that begins, you must shut off and restart.  Something not always possible on narrow mountain roads with drop-offs and no shoulder, and esp in tourist traffic.  Even paying attention to using the throttle excessively does not work.  I know, I bought a 07 new and tried to ride it around Colorado Rockies for a year or so and eventually had to park it.  It was amazing and infuriating how easily ECU became confused.  Even after getting the direction from Yamaha to open it up more often, that just did not work under my typical riding conditions.

 

Lots of fun having service people and internet "experts" tell you you don't know how to ride a motorcycle in the mountains when maybe they don't actually have a bike with this particular problem.  Not all 06's and 07's exhibited this behavior, I do not know why.  Just to be clear.  If you do not have an 06-07 that displays this behavior, you do not know WTF you are talking about, and you are not helping by telling people they don't know how to ride a motorcycle.

 

The only way to ride it without getting this issue was either two up riding moderately aggressively or solo riding VERY aggressively, both really require wide open no traffic situations.  And even then it would still happen sometimes if you got stuck behind a RV just for a little while for example going uphill.  Try to pass....stumble/stall.  Lots of fun.  However where (winding canyons leading to continental divide) and how (solo) I rode invariably you'd get stuck behind traffic or just long enough to set in motion whatever accumulation process in the ECU led to this.    Believe me I tried often enough and it seemed no matter how hard I rode it at some point that buffer in the ECU would overflow or whatever, and the bike would start to stumble then stall.  Really annoying unpredictable, and frankly scary.  Once it started to stumble nothing would fix it, no amount of throttle, short of stop and restart.  I parked it until Yamaha came out with a fix, and yes I was involved from the very beginning summer of 07 lobbying them by phone and other means to pay attention before somebody got killed. IMHO the bike was deadly.  

 

To Yamaha's credit, once they were able to reproduce the problem using their test riders, they came out with a fix almost immediately.  However they treated their customers pretty poorly prior to that.

 

Mr. C and others I feel your pain.  I did get the updated (USA) ECU and while it fixed this particular problem, the fueling on this year still seems to be nothing but trouble at altitude and large elevation deltas.  I currently run a PCV + autotune and that has cleared up most of the other issues.