FJRF009.4 "Spider"/Intermittent Ground Wire Failures 2010 and Later Research

[extra-ordinary_guy]

Looks like mcatrophy has the correct answer. Looks like S4 has been removed with all the wires soldered together, although it looks like one wire is corroded and broken off? If that's the case, then that would definitely explain your symptoms with neutral light/high beam lamp on/etc...

The frame has been replaced on my bike (after a bad crash when it was a police bike) and I'm wondering was the broken blue wire bringing this cluster back to ground but was snipped when the loom was transplanted. Guy who did the work is gone out of business now so I've no way of knowing. I've gone around the other seven and took the corrosion off the spider itself but is there a tip on getting the individual connectors out of the spider connector blocks?

 

[mcatrophy]

Looks like mcatrophy has the correct answer. Looks like S4 has been removed with all the wires soldered together, although it looks like one wire is corroded and broken off? If that's the case, then that would definitely explain your symptoms with neutral light/high beam lamp on/etc...

The frame has been replaced on my bike (after a bad crash when it was a police bike) and I'm wondering was the broken blue wire bringing this cluster back to ground but was snipped when the loom was transplanted. Guy who did the work is gone out of business now so I've no way of knowing. I've gone around the other seven and took the corrosion off the spider itself but is there a tip on getting the individual connectors out of the spider connector blocks?

If your electricals have ever worked correctly since the transplant then there must be a ground to that spider cluster. Of course, it could go through another, possibly corroding, spider, so no guarantees things will remain good.

 

[extra-ordinary_guy]

Looks like mcatrophy has the correct answer. Looks like S4 has been removed with all the wires soldered together, although it looks like one wire is corroded and broken off? If that's the case, then that would definitely explain your symptoms with neutral light/high beam lamp on/etc...

The frame has been replaced on my bike (after a bad crash when it was a police bike) and I'm wondering was the broken blue wire bringing this cluster back to ground but was snipped when the loom was transplanted. Guy who did the work is gone out of business now so I've no way of knowing. I've gone around the other seven and took the corrosion off the spider itself but is there a tip on getting the individual connectors out of the spider connector blocks?

If your electricals have ever worked correctly since the transplant then there must be a ground to that spider cluster. Of course, it could go through another, possibly corroding, spider, so no guarantees things will remain good.

Apologies for the late reply but - why must there be a ground to that spider cluster? That spider cluster IS a ground, no? I was thinking the extra blue wire was a fail-safe that was possibly snipped during the transplant. That's not to say this is the cause of any of my issues, more I was just trying to establish the possible history of my electrics. I've come to this late and Brodie harnesses etc seem long gone so it's looking like snipping the other 5 spiders and soldering is the only solution open to me.

 

[mcatrophy]

Looks like mcatrophy has the correct answer. Looks like S4 has been removed with all the wires soldered together, although it looks like one wire is corroded and broken off? If that's the case, then that would definitely explain your symptoms with neutral light/high beam lamp on/etc...

The frame has been replaced on my bike (after a bad crash when it was a police bike) and I'm wondering was the broken blue wire bringing this cluster back to ground but was snipped when the loom was transplanted. Guy who did the work is gone out of business now so I've no way of knowing. I've gone around the other seven and took the corrosion off the spider itself but is there a tip on getting the individual connectors out of the spider connector blocks?

If your electricals have ever worked correctly since the transplant then there must be a ground to that spider cluster. Of course, it could go through another, possibly corroding, spider, so no guarantees things will remain good.

Apologies for the late reply but - why must there be a ground to that spider cluster? That spider cluster IS a ground, no? I was thinking the extra blue wire was a fail-safe that was possibly snipped during the transplant. That's not to say this is the cause of any of my issues, more I was just trying to establish the possible history of my electrics. I've come to this late and Brodie harnesses etc seem long gone so it's looking like snipping the other 5 spiders and soldering is the only solution open to me.

Every spider is at ground potential on a properly functioning bike, even if that connection comes through a series of other spiders. So, one of the wires on each spiders is the ground feed to that spider. If your bike was OK after its transplant, then there must have been a ground feed.
Of course, if a spider fails, any down-stream spider will lose its ground feed.

 

[old1959]

I have a 2011 with approximately 48k miles and found a corroded under the left headlight ground block (S7). My problem (no headlight, turn signals, windscreen movement, heated grips & indicator lights on) started last April on a ride from Seattle to Houston via the PCH and since I felt headlights, turn signals, etc. are important I stopped at a Yamaha dealer near Victorville, California (nice folks and took me in right away I would add). The tech couldn't find anything wrong but contacted Yamaha support who told him to replace the "starter cut-off relay" or often called "relay"; P/N 5VK-81950-30. Of course, relay wasn't in stock so confident that the rest of the bike was okay I continued my trip. After arriving in Houston, I replaced the relay. Everything worked fine for another thousand miles. However, the problem re-appeared. This time I researched the forum and decided to inspect all the ground blocks (or spiders). All were in good condition except for under the left headlight. Consequently, for the ones in good condition, I filled them with dielectric grease and the corroded one I removed, split the five or six wires into two heavy (14 gauge?) which routed to the negative terminal of the battery. I'm pleased to report that everything works fine and would like to thank this forum for wonderful tips and guidance. I also want to add that I'm a bit disappointed with Yamaha engineering on this particular issue. Grounding circuits shouldn't be an issue; this is well understood science and a lot of motorcycles get this right. Ride safe.

https://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/GreenDR/IMG_1930.jpg

 

[mcatrophy]

Image help:

 

[Proteus1952]

I have to add my sincere thanks also to all of the electrical system gurus on this forum who saved my butt about a year ago when on a really hot Texas day all of the typical haywire electrical malfunctions began exhibiting themselves. I did some serious research on the forum. Set up a clean "operating theater" in my garage, and then methodically and very carefully accessed, examined and serviced all of the spiders. Used the dielectric grease on all of them and with great trepidation, actually cut and soldered one of them. Everything has worked superbly since the surgery. Funny part of the tale is that just before the cut and soldering part, I had the opportunity to visit the local Yamaha dealer. Asked about the cut and solder part with the guy at the parts counter and he looked at me like I was nutz. Then after he went back to get the parts I was after, he said the service tech he spoke with agreed that the cut and solder was a good solution. I'll tackle just about any maintenance task with some solid advice and a few pictures. This forum is a place that is filled with both. Thanks again to all of you electrical experts.

 

[Harald]

I have a 2011 with approximately 48k miles and found a corroded under the left headlight ground block (S7). My problem (no headlight, turn signals, windscreen movement, heated grips & indicator lights on) started last April on a ride from Seattle to Houston via the PCH and since I felt headlights, turn signals, etc. are important I stopped at a Yamaha dealer near Victorville, California (nice folks and took me in right away I would add). The tech couldn't find anything wrong but contacted Yamaha support who told him to replace the "starter cut-off relay" or often called "relay"; P/N 5VK-81950-30. Of course, relay wasn't in stock so confident that the rest of the bike was okay I continued my trip. After arriving in Houston, I replaced the relay. Everything worked fine for another thousand miles. However, the problem re-appeared. This time I researched the forum and decided to inspect all the ground blocks (or spiders). All were in good condition except for under the left headlight. Consequently, for the ones in good condition, I filled them with dielectric grease and the corroded one I removed, split the five or six wires into two heavy (14 gauge?) which routed to the negative terminal of the battery. I'm pleased to report that everything works fine and would like to thank this forum for wonderful tips and guidance. I also want to add that I'm a bit disappointed with Yamaha engineering on this particular issue. Grounding circuits shouldn't be an issue; this is well understood science and a lot of motorcycles get this right. Ride safe.
https://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/GreenDR/IMG_1930.jpg

Welcome to the exclusive S7 failure club! I'm also a member with my 2007 FJR.

Thanks for reporting this here Old1959. I also highly suggest filing a report at www.safercar.gov so that a recall can be initiated if enough failures occur. Your 2011 was not part of the recall

NHTSA Campaign Number: 11V-338 that affected 2006-2009 FJR's.

 

[Harald]

I have to add my sincere thanks also to all of the electrical system gurus on this forum who saved my butt about a year ago when on a really hot Texas day all of the typical haywire electrical malfunctions began exhibiting themselves. I did some serious research on the forum. Set up a clean "operating theater" in my garage, and then methodically and very carefully accessed, examined and serviced all of the spiders. Used the dielectric grease on all of them and with great trepidation, actually cut and soldered one of them. Everything has worked superbly since the surgery. Funny part of the tale is that just before the cut and soldering part, I had the opportunity to visit the local Yamaha dealer. Asked about the cut and solder part with the guy at the parts counter and he looked at me like I was nutz. Then after he went back to get the parts I was after, he said the service tech he spoke with agreed that the cut and solder was a good solution. I'll tackle just about any maintenance task with some solid advice and a few pictures. This forum is a place that is filled with both. Thanks again to all of you electrical experts.

Thanks for reporting Proteus1952. We are trying to track which spiders are failing for the Forum's collective knowledge, so can you describe where the failed spider was that you repaired?

I also highly suggest filing a report at www.safercar.gov so that a recall can be initiated if enough failures occur. Your 2010 was not part of the " S4 spider" recall

NHTSA Campaign Number: 11V-338 that affected 2006-2009 FJR's.

 

[Harald]

WRXDRIVER2011 reported a S7 failure on his 2010/2011 FJR here:

https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php/topic/170521-fjr-headlight-problem-possibly-dimmer-relay/?p=1348057

 

[Harald]

Neil San Diego had a S7 failure on his 2012, as reported here:

https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php/topic/139511-fjrf0093-spider-failures-other-than-s4-research/?p=1358440

 

[Davidmiller]

Just received word from Niehause Cycles at Litchfield, Illinois that my "spyderbite" on my 2010 fjr has been fixed at a cost of $232 dollars. It was the spyderbite under the glove compartment. The bike has 16850 miles on it, mostly touring miles. They removed the spyderbite and soldered the wires together, otherwise they would have to replace the wiring bundle. This was done after contacting Yamaha.

 

[Queensland Ken]

The Classic S6 neutral connector.

A few things I'd like to say about the various faults, they are either 12 or 5 volt Neutrals and NOT ground !

They become a "ground" once the single point of attachment is connected.

The two 5 volt spiders ARE NEVER ATTACHED to the frame or the -VE Battery terminal.

The 5 volt transducer power supply is supplied via the ECU only !!!, NEVER attach the S2 or S5 to anything 12 volt.

 

[Impala-joe]

Queensland Ken, Great post. I have a 2009 AE, bought last year with 7,000 miles. Road it for 2 months without issue. Stored for 10 months, it now has 8,400 miles, add a new battery and it started right up and headed out for a ride. After a quick stop it would not start. Sounds like a grounding issue as described in many posts, towed home. Called Yamaha and they said my bike had both switch and ground recall already fixed. It sounds like it could still be a grounding issue. Question, can we buy individual connectors from Yamaha? It kind of sounds like we can.

 

[RossKean]

Ken passed away just a few months after the above post (October, 2017).

https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php/topic/173908-queensland-ken-rip/

I don't think that the connectors are available from Yamaha but I am not sure.

 

[mcatrophy]

...After a quick stop it would not start....

Had the engine warmed up? One well known "feature" of the FJR is that it floods easily if turned off after a few seconds. Trying to restart, the engine spins but doesn't fire.

Needs to be churned with a wide open throttle, it will eventually start (the more mechanically sympathetic will say do it in ten-second bursts).

 

[rbentnail]

I didn't check to purchase anything when my S4 died. I did like everyone else and cut it out & soldered the wires together. My symptoms, details & pics of repair here ->

edit: why can't I post a link to a thread in this F-in forum?

 

[rbentnail]

edit- updated link

 

[RossKean]

I still want to dig into all of the spider connections in my 2011 (bought early last year).  Currently just over 100,000 km and I have had no issues or symptoms yet after two separate incidents on my '07.  I would like to keep it that way.  I keep saying that jobs like this are winter works projects but the fact is that my garage is too cold to work in during winter months and warmer weather is made for riding.  In addition to the spider work, I need to rewire some electrical farkles and do an overdue valve check.  I probably need a solid week of rain to keep me home and bored without the possibility of riding or doing some desperately needed yard work!

I just noticed that the spiderbite jpg that many of us are using in our signature lines is now very blurred.  For most of us, I think that the jpg is a Photobucket link and something has changed.  (Function of the updated forum?)  Odd - it is blurred on my computer but not on my phone.

Anyway, I was wondering if anyone had a saved version of the "spider" image?

https://i547.photobucket.com/albums/hh458/ElCajone/groundspider.jpg

 

[mcatrophy]

edit: why can't I post a link to a thread in this F-in forum?

Off topic, but anyway - try clicking the "share" icon, top right of the post. This will get you to the link one way or another (depends on your platform).