Dedicated GPS vs Cell Phone

[Spud]

I love my dedicated GPS (tom tom rider). My current phone is a Galaxy Note 8 that cost $1K, don't want it mounted on my bike even if it's waterproof. I ride through a lot of areas with no cell coverage, and crossing between US and Canada is nice as I set the mph to kph. I mainly use it to know distances between towns stops, not really to guide me, although in bigger cities I sometimes go through (salt lake ie) it's really helpful. If you tour a lot I think it's a farkle worth the money, even though phones work so well now.

 

[BigOgre]

Saw this over on ADV awhile ago. Admired the ingenuity. I know it doesn't directly answer your questions but it might spark an idea.

https://advrider.com/index.php?threads/1190-r-gets-a-little-tesla-nav-for-an-old-guy.1288977/

 

[RossKean]

I love my dedicated GPS (tom tom rider). My current phone is a Galaxy Note 8 that cost $1K, don't want it mounted on my bike even if it's waterproof. I ride through a lot of areas with no cell coverage, and crossing between US and Canada is nice as I set the mph to kph. I mainly use it to know distances between towns stops, not really to guide me, although in bigger cities I sometimes go through (salt lake ie) it's really helpful. If you tour a lot I think it's a farkle worth the money, even though phones work so well now.

If I could make my Zumo work better, I wouldn't be considering a phone alternative. I can replace the weak battery and I can transfer data to the SD card but unless I can make it more readable on a bright day, it will continue to be a major irritation to me. I have been trying to get some information on aftermarket replacement screens and there are some eBay sellers. No information anywhere I can find that relates to the brightness of the replacements. I have compared mine to others and haven't noticed any major difference.

How is the TomTom for screen readability under bright conditions?

 

[gregory]

Been in this quandary too, since the 550 decided to die a quiet death. Looking at the Zumo 395LM.

 

[Spud]

In direct sunlight it's not that easy to read, but without the sun hitting right on very good, and switches to a night mode when it gets dark enough. There is a newer model than mine (this is my second rider). Mine is like this:

The newer version is this:

https://www.tomtom.com/en_us/drive/motorcycle/

What I really like is how tough they are built.... probably a little less sophisticated than the Zumo though, but cost less too.

Also from this older thread, they've got a device now that uses your phone but it blu-tooths the phone's info to a display. This seems like a cool idea!

https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php/topic/173961-interesting-little-gps-for-scooters/

 

[sapest]

665 defence -

My unit will accept and read a 16G SD card. FWIW the card is marked HC, and is only Class 2 rated.

Using Mapinstaller isnt that much of a pain, but it does add time to an already slow process.

Are you wearing polarized sunglasses? These will impact how bright the Zumo screen will appear.

Have you tried a sun shield? This hood works well, except when the sun is behind you.

https://www.priushood.com/gazu660665su.html

The scary part of staying with the Zumo low supply of GXM 40 antennas. Dont lose or break yours!

-Steve

 

[FJRay]

I've been using the same 660 on a few different bikes and my truck with good results. I'm not much for transferring routes from the puter but use the GPS for routing the next days travel. I don't enough about using a phone cause I still have a flip phone. I have a 32gb card full of music and the blue tooth to the Sena works well. I haven't tried to pair the phone because I really don't want to talk to anybody while I'm riding. They can leave a message and I might call back I use a sun shade that attaches with velcro and it works OK unless the sun is directly on it and then I don't think anything works. I did have a 590 on the Spyder and it worked well.

 

[RossKean]

665 defence -My unit will accept and read a 16G SD card. FWIW the card is marked HC, and is only Class 2 rated.

Using Mapinstaller isnt that much of a pain, but it does add time to an already slow process.

Are you wearing polarized sunglasses? These will impact how bright the Zumo screen will appear.

Have you tried a sun shield? This hood works well, except when the sun is behind you.

https://www.priushood.com/gazu660665su.html

The scary part of staying with the Zumo low supply of GXM 40 antennas. Dont lose or break yours!

-Steve

No to polarized glasses - I know they don't play well with LCD displays. Don't normally wear sunglasses of any sort other than a light tint visor. Not using a hood for the GPS but will give it a try.

There seems to be some controversy over how large a card will work in a Zumo 665. I have an 8 gb card in mine because "Internet Wisdom" suggested that it was the maximum size that would work reliably. Perhaps I'll try the 16 gb. (Will a lower class card be more reliable?)

I received the 665 as a gift a number of years ago and have NEVER used the satellite radio or the GXM 40 antenna. Maybe I'll sell the antenna once they become really scarce! I have heard the cradles and wiring harnesses have become scarce as well.

 

[SkipS]

I use my $149 galaxy J7. I use the app "Android Auto" and blue tooth it to my Sena in the helmet. I make a route in google maps then send it to my phone. I always download the offline maps and then the turn by turn directions still work. I have not used my Garmin since I got the this FJR last Sept. I use a waterproof phone bag (like the one I use when I kayak) when its raining. I did 5 hours in the rain last friday and rode Back roads from central CT. to central New Hampshire and had all my turn by turn directions . My phone carrier is Virgin Mobile so I know I was out of service in some areas. The Key is to make sure you download the google offline maps to cover what ever area you plan on riding in.

 

[RossKean]

I've been using the same 660 on a few different bikes and my truck with good results. I'm not much for transferring routes from the puter but use the GPS for routing the next days travel. I don't enough about using a phone cause I still have a flip phone. I have a 32gb card full of music and the blue tooth to the Sena works well. I haven't tried to pair the phone because I really don't want to talk to anybody while I'm riding. They can leave a message and I might call back I use a sun shade that attaches with velcro and it works OK unless the sun is directly on it and then I don't think anything works. I did have a 590 on the Spyder and it worked well.

Garmin GPS routing for a not-too-complex day ride isn't awful unless you are doing an indirect route. A lot of zooming in and out to get things right. BaseCamp is a pretty good tool for seeing the big picture and seems to transfer routes quite well (always check close-up before trusting them!!). Don't listen to a lot of music while riding so don't need the GPS for that. Can always use the phone for music, if I want more...

 

[sapest]

665 defence -My unit will accept and read a 16G SD card. FWIW the card is marked HC, and is only Class 2 rated.Using Mapinstaller isnt that much of a pain, but it does add time to an already slow process.Are you wearing polarized sunglasses? These will impact how bright the Zumo screen will appear.Have you tried a sun shield? This hood works well, except when the sun is behind you.https://www.priushood.com/gazu660665su.htmlThe scary part of staying with the Zumo low supply of GXM 40 antennas. Dont lose or break yours!-Steve

No to polarized glasses - I know they don't play well with LCD displays. Don't normally wear sunglasses of any sort other than a light tint visor. Not using a hood for the GPS but will give it a try.There seems to be some controversy over how large a card will work in a Zumo 665. I have an 8 gb card in mine because "Internet Wisdom" suggested that it was the maximum size that would work reliably. Perhaps I'll try the 16 gb. (Will a lower class card be more reliable?)I received the 665 as a gift a number of years ago and have NEVER used the satellite radio or the GXM 40 antenna. Maybe I'll sell the antenna once they become really scarce! I have heard the cradles and wiring harnesses have become scarce as well.

The current map (2019.x) is about 2.4G, so even 8G's of storage is going to be enough for a while. I just cant see where a smartphone can beat any GPS in terms of finding the closest 'x'. (Icons vs entering text)

 

[RossKean]

665 defence -My unit will accept and read a 16G SD card. FWIW the card is marked HC, and is only Class 2 rated.Using Mapinstaller isnt that much of a pain, but it does add time to an already slow process.Are you wearing polarized sunglasses? These will impact how bright the Zumo screen will appear.Have you tried a sun shield? This hood works well, except when the sun is behind you.https://www.priushood.com/gazu660665su.htmlThe scary part of staying with the Zumo low supply of GXM 40 antennas. Dont lose or break yours!-Steve

No to polarized glasses - I know they don't play well with LCD displays. Don't normally wear sunglasses of any sort other than a light tint visor. Not using a hood for the GPS but will give it a try.There seems to be some controversy over how large a card will work in a Zumo 665. I have an 8 gb card in mine because "Internet Wisdom" suggested that it was the maximum size that would work reliably. Perhaps I'll try the 16 gb. (Will a lower class card be more reliable?)I received the 665 as a gift a number of years ago and have NEVER used the satellite radio or the GXM 40 antenna. Maybe I'll sell the antenna once they become really scarce! I have heard the cradles and wiring harnesses have become scarce as well.

The current map (2019.x) is about 2.4G, so even 8G's of storage is going to be enough for a while.I just cant see where a smartphone can beat any GPS in terms of finding the closest 'x'. (Icons vs entering text)

The whole North America mapset plus POI doesn't fit in the unit's main memory - have to stop at the Mexico border or go to the SD card.

As far as I am concerned, the phone is vastly superior technology in terms of processor capability, processor speed, memory capacity, display etc. It is missing (as far as I can tell so far) a stellar on-board app and dedicated maps that can work seamlessly with a solid computer-based mapping/trip planning software suite. Camera (still and video), phone, GPS, weather, web browser, music - even a high quality accelerometer. I am surprised that Google hasn't come up with something to drive Garmin out of business. I think the ideal scenario might be to protect the expensive phone and sell the software package for the phone and a remote 7" waterproof dumb (but optically bright) display that communicates via Bluetooth to the phone in your pocket. Maybe the market is too small to interest Google or other developer? A dedicated GPS can't do anything that a modern cellphone can't do - just software.

 

[Northwoods Snowman]

I have used my Samsung S4 Active I use on the bike. I just use Google Maps. I need to figure out downloading map sections but when I went out to NAFO in '16 I created a custom route in my maps on the cumputer, saved it in my Google account and opened it up on the phone and it worked like a charm. I have a hand held GPS that I also have on the bike but that only tells me where I am at. No routing. It tells me where I am and I navigate if the phone doesn't have service, which was never a problem going our to Colorado. Beauty of the handheld is the track log. I use a ram x mount for the phone and have a dual 2.1a USB port mounted on the bike to power the phone and GpPro.

 

[sapest]

My comment about SD card was just that, given the map file sizes, even an 8G card will be enough storage for a while. Yes, the 66x on board storage is lacking, yes if you want all of NA, you must go to secondary storage. Maybe I am fooling myself, but I think screens load faster with the maps on the SD card.

Everything you say about the smartphone is true. I was talking about interface, not technology. The garmin can find the closest Italian Rest or gas station with about 6 or 7 icon taps, something I can do while stopped at a red light. I dont have to open Google maps and type "gas station near me".

Where I would like to roast Garmins cherries is the out of date POI listings. Major malfunction on occasion.

-Steve

 

[RossKean]

My comment about SD card was just that, given the map file sizes, even an 8G card will be enough storage for a while. Yes, the 66x on board storage is lacking, yes if you want all of NA, you must go to secondary storage. Maybe I am fooling myself, but I think screens load faster with the maps on the SD card.Everything you say about the smartphone is true. I was talking about interface, not technology. The garmin can find the closest Italian Rest or gas station with about 6 or 7 icon taps, something I can do while stopped at a red light. I dont have to open Google maps and type "gas station near me".

Where I would like to roast Garmins cherries is the out of date POI listings. Major malfunction on occasion.

-Steve

I don't disagree with what you are saying. The phone is superior in practically every way - EXCEPT software. I suspect Garmin allowed the map/POI file to grow to its current size primarily to render older GPS with lifetime maps obsolete. There is no way that a mapset for North America has to occupy that much space! A lot of devices cannot use an SD card and even fewer owners are capable of implementing that swap of storage allocation the first time the map download fails due to insufficient space. Since I don't have any plans to ride in Mexico in the near future, I haven't (yet) put my maps on the SD card but probably shall do so - especially if it speeds things up. (So far, I have managed with the internal memory by leaving out Mexico, deleting alternate languages, help files, voices and icons as well as placing routes etc. on the SD card.)

 

[ogopogo]

I dont have to open Google maps and type "gas station near me".

My KIS method is to press the home button on my phone and say "navigate to nearest gas station." The only wrinkle is that occasionally the "nearest" station can be behind me, or miles off course. I'm sure somebody has a clever workaround but mine is to wait a few miles and ask again.

 

[TomInPA]

I have been using the Zumo 590 for a long time. I recently went from an Autocom to the Sena 20S and have experimented with using the phone or the GPS. I have found that provided the GPS is configured correctly, the functions are easier to access and I don't give up sound quality. The first trick is the phone must be ocnnnected as an iPhone in my case, rather than through just Bluetooth. This enables the application like Pandora and greatly improves sound quality. The 590 is sunlight readable, and I have overheated phones on the road before. So I have a glove-friendly interface for changing music media, handling phone calls and reliable navigation with via and way points that the phone does not offer.

Using the phone is dead simple. It is only one device to set up, sound quality is great. I don't have gloves that work with my touchscreen, so removing gloves is a hassle, and the screen is a lot more distracting than the GPS. I worry about the phone in the Xgrip with webbing. New iPhone Plus is a $900 investment, and it is relatively fragile for vibration, heat, cold, water and drops. In spite of the setup hassles of using multiple devices I'll continue using the Zumo 590. I can't wait for Garmin to get their shit together and create a motorcycle navigator with Apple CarPlay integrated for media functions.

 

[jblanken64]

...
Using the phone is dead simple. It is only one device to set up, sound quality is great. I don't have gloves that work with my touchscreen, so removing gloves is a hassle, and the screen is a lot more distracting than the GPS. I worry about the phone in the Xgrip with webbing. New iPhone Plus is a $900 investment, and it is relatively fragile for vibration, heat, cold, water and drops. In spite of the setup hassles of using multiple devices I'll continue using the Zumo 590. I can't wait for Garmin to get their shit together and create a motorcycle navigator with Apple CarPlay integrated for media functions.

Try these: https://www.nanotips.com/products/taps-touchscreen-sticker

I added some to some Olympia winter gloves and they do a very good job of machine the glove touchscreen compatible. Supposedly the glove can even be registered as a fingerprint, but I haven't tried that yet.

 

[sapest]

My comment about SD card was just that, given the map file sizes, even an 8G card will be enough storage for a while. Yes, the 66x on board storage is lacking, yes if you want all of NA, you must go to secondary storage. Maybe I am fooling myself, but I think screens load faster with the maps on the SD card.Everything you say about the smartphone is true. I was talking about interface, not technology. The garmin can find the closest Italian Rest or gas station with about 6 or 7 icon taps, something I can do while stopped at a red light. I dont have to open Google maps and type "gas station near me".Where I would like to roast Garmins cherries is the out of date POI listings. Major malfunction on occasion.-Steve

I don't disagree with what you are saying. The phone is superior in practically every way - EXCEPT software. I suspect Garmin allowed the map/POI file to grow to its current size primarily to render older GPS with lifetime maps obsolete. There is no way that a mapset for North America has to occupy that much space! A lot of devices cannot use an SD card and even fewer owners are capable of implementing that swap of storage allocation the first time the map download fails due to insufficient space. Since I don't have any plans to ride in Mexico in the near future, I haven't (yet) put my maps on the SD card but probably shall do so - especially if it speeds things up. (So far, I have managed with the internal memory by leaving out Mexico, deleting alternate languages, help files, voices and icons as well as placing routes etc. on the SD card.)

Not to turn this into a Zumo tutorial - this is what I do with maps and SD card.Choose any segment of map to install and be sure to choose download to device and computer. (Make sure you know where the maps end up on your PC)

After the update finishes, start the zumo and let the new map load and be sure all is well.

Be sure your SD card is installed in the zumo.

Connect zumo to PC and fire up Mapinstaller.

Tell Mapinstaller you want to load maps to the SD card, not the zumo.

Highlight all the map segments you want. Go crazy, lots of room. I think I loaded 183 segements the last time.

Let Mapinstaller do its thing.

After Mapinstaller is done, in Windows Explorer, find the zumo internal storage, perhaps drive E or F; and find the map file in the .SYSTEM folder (it will be a hidden Folder) It will be the one giant .img file. Change the extension from .img to .sav.

Disconnect the zumo and fire it up and make sure all is well.

If not ok, go back and change .sav back to .img. The zumo will work and you can go ride.

Something went wrong. Ponder things before you do anything else.

If all ok, reconnect the zumo to the PC, find the file on the zumo you renamed and delete it.

Its much easier to do than describe. The extra steps are there because I have found that the update process is flaky no matter how solid your internet connection is and you can download a bad map on occasion. Garmin servers must be of the same age as their GPS code.

You should hook up the antenna in late Aug. XM gives away two weeks of free weather notification, sometime around the Aug long weekend. Its fun to be told "rain is nearby" 10 minutes after you get wet. And every once in a while some sat radio channels will be free to try.

-Steve

 

[RossKean]

^^^

Nice description of the process.

One more comment for those who are doing this. The SD card is less robust than the internal memory of the Zumo. Make an extra copy of EVERYTHING on a spare card you carry with you and on the computer. I have had glitched SD cards in the past and even if you can restore from backup, it doesn't help much on the road somewhere.

Have you always used Mapinstaller rather than Garmin Express? The latter is one of the crappiest pieces of software I have ever encountered although more recent iterations are improved.