I'm done with FJRForum mods

[majicmaker]

I'm Speechless.

 

[Bounce]

So, it's okay for everyone to post anything from near-porn to personal attacks but I ask a basic question that's been on my mind since about page 8 of this thread and suddenly those demanding tolerance become intolerant?

I was asking as me. I wasn't "moderating" anything. I was simply curious if PMs weren't as effective so something public and dramatic was chosen for a higher profile. But that's just me based on the public posts about (paraphrased) "thanks for the PM" or "Thanks for the" whatever when people directly address W in the new member section on the riders forum. Even if it's not the case, it's hard not to reach that conclusion based on a high profile (announced) departure.

Past examples (over the course of decades) in Usenet newsgroups and places like ST.N tend to be more a function of visibility than actual departure.

 

[MCRIDER007]

So, it's okay for everyone to post anything from near-porn to personal attacks but I ask a basic question that's been on my mind since about page 8 of this thread and suddenly those demanding tolerance become intolerant?
I was asking as me. I wasn't "moderating" anything. I was simply curious if PMs weren't as effective so something public and dramatic was chosen for a higher profile. But that's just me based on the public posts about (paraphrased) "thanks for the PM" or "Thanks for the" whatever when people directly address W in the new member section on the riders forum. Even if it's not the case, it's hard not to reach that conclusion based on a high profile (announced) departure.

Past examples (over the course of decades) in Usenet newsgroups and places like ST.N tend to be more a function of visibility than actual departure.

Please don't pollute this thread with historical facts, logic, analytical thinking, or pertinent questions; its already far too confusing to fully comprehend.

 

[Bounce]

And I'll publicly apologize if I'm confusing the current W departure with someone else and not his own in the past.

 

[gregory]

Just wow.

If Wheaton had just 10 posts and 9 were troll posts then maybe recruitment might be a motive. But with 13,223 I think he is being pretty genuine in how he feels. It's obvious from the response to this thread many feel the same, there was a reason the other sandbox came to be.

 

[ionbeam]

Redacted accurate but unhelpful post.

 

[RossKean]

Some people seem to be trying to set up the moderators as the enemy. WTF? I think Bounce's post may have been a bit off the mark (I don't think Wheaton is trying to subvert the forum and create a mass exodus). I would suggest, however, that if a non-moderator had made this remark, the responses wouldn't have been quite so reactionary (or abusive). I like this place - great technical assistance and I have met a lot of great people here. For the most part, I play by the rules even if I don't agree 100% with them. It's hardly an oppressive environment and I have every intention of sticking around for the information and fun. I don't envy the moderator's job and wouldn't want to try to walk the fine line between total mayhem and running it like a church meeting.

I appreciate what has been done to curb some of the nonsense even if it isn't precisely the method I might have used. I visit other internet resources for an alternate viewpoint on the FJR but always end out back here. I would be very disappointed if this site disappeared but I don't think I would blame the admin team if they decided they had enough and packed it in. There will always be those who don't like the way things are run. They are free to put up with it or leave. If they can provide constructive criticism, they should do so; otherwise they should gracefully choose to go elsewhere without trying to lob a grenade through the door on the way out.

Its been a long fucking winter and I'm just trying to hold on until I can ride instead of just talking about it!

Cheers!

 

[Geezer]

An honest question based on curiosity from the most recent reply, the OP, and the last time W went off in a huff, proclaiming he'd never come back.
Was it really based on what was said or was it simply a dramatic way of recruiting for other boards?

What I said earlier about personalities applies here for sure. I would never have even considered the possibility, and still don't, because there is absolutely no reason to even suspect such a thing. The forums are open to all, not mutually exclusive. I enjoy participation in both. If I didn't have an irrational dislike for Facebook I'd play in that sandbox as well. This is not a competition between fora. It is a good thing that there is another place or two to go.

 

[SoCalFJR1300]

An honest question based on curiosity from the most recent reply, the OP, and the last time W went off in a huff, proclaiming he'd never come back.
Was it really based on what was said or was it simply a dramatic way of recruiting for other boards?

Why would you even be concerned about that??

All you have to do is search for FJR sites and this one and the other forum pop up, you don't have to "recruit"

 

[Fred W]

(I apologize in advance for my (typical) long winded-ness

Yeah, it's been a long winter, but while that may explain why this thread has so many people interested, I don't think it explains its occurrence.

Why are folks getting all worked up over Bounce's question? Although his conclusion is completely wrong (IMO), he does have a valid question. That being: What was the main purpose of Wheaton posting up this public farewell thread?

I do not believe it was to recruit for any other forums as was supposed. Most everyone here who is the least bit passionate about their FJRs or motorcycles in general already participates in many of those other forums.

Was it alerting the other members to the strictness of certain moderators? I think that we all knew that already, and those that continue here for any length of time have accepted that as a part of the deal in participating here.

So, my gut feeling (and I think this is the only truly plausible explanation) is that Wheaton actually cares a lot about this forum and the people here, and he hoped that by stirring up the pot with a little high drama he might influence a change of some of the heavy handedness in the administration in the future.

Geezer talks about civil disobedience, and I agree whole-heartedly. I see Mark's grandiose announcement as just another form of protest. Sure one could just vote with their feet and quietly choose to not participate. And we all know that there have been many who have made that choice and done just that. But will anyone notice? Will anything ever change that way?

I received a private email just last week from (IMO) one of the most valuable forum regulars and a personal friend. Here's a guy that makes doodads and farkles for other FJR owners that can not be found anywhere else at any price, and sells them for nearly the cost of the materials and shipping (many may not realize that), so in essence he donates his spare time to the enjoyment of the FJR community. Those that have been around more than a few days know who I am talking about. In that private email he told me that he would not be posting here anymore due to continued run-ins with the admins. He will continue to make his farkles for his forum friends, but isn't willing to risk the personal abuse of pissing anyone off any more. This saddens me greatly.

I think we all appreciate that herding the cats on a forum the size and diversity of this one is a difficult and often thankless job. And we also all seem to appreciate that it is a job that needs to be done or else the forum would devolve into a chaotic mess of political and religious arguments, such as are rampant elsewhere on the intarwebs, that would not be worthy of the time and effort to participate in.

So yes, KJ, there does need to be rules in public societies, even out here on the wild, wild internet. And there needs to be sheriffs who administer those rules.

But, there also has to be some middle ground somewhere. Rules can be administered without the enforcers becoming personally insulting, derogatory or just plain nasty about it. Ask AJ (or any of the other policemen on the forum) what makes the difference between a good sheriff and an overzealous (I use that word because AJ loves it so much

) authoritarian. We all know that finding that kind of balance can not be easy. And I would encourage people on both sides of the fence to maintain level heads and make the required effort to work together towards our common goals.

If there are some things that you think should be changed around here, why not speak up and propose them? No, it is not a democracy here. And the members are merely guests. We can't just take a "pole" and expect the results to be automatically enacted. But, I believe that the forum admins and forum collective actually have identical goals, so why can't there be compromise and cooperation to achieve those goals?

 

[PhilJet09]

I received a private email just last week from (IMO) one of the most valuable forum regulars and a personal friend. Here's a guy that makes doodads and farkles for other FJR owners that can not be found anywhere else at any price, and sells them for nearly the cost of the materials and shipping (many may not realize that), so in essence he donates his spare time to the enjoyment of the FJR community. Those that have been around more than a few days know who I am talking about. In that private email he told me that he would not be posting here anymore due to continued run-ins with the admins. He will continue to make his farkles for his forum friends, but isn't willing to risk the personal abuse of pissing anyone off any more. This saddens me greatly.

This is extremely unfortunate!

 

[whataboutbob]

Everyone gets offended sometimes. I know that It's been a blast being here the past 6 years.you peeps have a great sense of humor,alot of knowledge,compassion and fellowship.there is always going to be some conflict and thats how it is.one thing I can tell you for sure is I didn't know about the other fourm untill this thread! I will try to follow both and land where all you other crazy basterds land.I have been wondering where some of you have been.Bob

 

[TomInPA]

A similar thread came up last year, and I think when it was all said and done, there was a bit more moderation in the moderation for a while. As far as there being other forums, they are nice sandboxes, but nothing has come close to this one for organizing and talking about gatherings, or things of technical value. I like it here and have no intentions of leaving, nor have I been pushed to leave.

I also run a large for-profit forum and the moderation issues of balancing social entertainment with maintianing technical value are a tough balance to achieve. I think that this forum is not so large, that most of the issues couldn't be dealt with privately with mutual agreements, rather than letting things get this combustible.

If everyone would take some responsibility and recognize when it's okay to be silly, and when it's just disruptive, we wouldn't need moderators. By the same token, not all silliness is in need of modertion.

 

[Geezer]

I received a private email just last week from (IMO) one of the most valuable forum regulars and a personal friend. Here's a guy that makes doodads and farkles for other FJR owners that can not be found anywhere else at any price, and sells them for nearly the cost of the materials and shipping (many may not realize that), so in essence he donates his spare time to the enjoyment of the FJR community. Those that have been around more than a few days know who I am talking about. In that private email he told me that he would not be posting here anymore due to continued run-ins with the admins. He will continue to make his farkles for his forum friends, but isn't willing to risk the personal abuse of pissing anyone off any more. This saddens me greatly.

This is extremely unfortunate!

Gunny.

 

[puppychow]

Wheatie, I will miss you, but I KNOW I will see you in the real world in the future and I hope soon, and we will pick-up our friendship and camaraderie from where we left off the last time I saw you. I will miss you and your banter in the meanwhile. Best wishes!

 

[Bounce]

(I apologize in advance for my (typical) long winded-ness
Yeah, it's been a long winter, but while that may explain why this thread has so many people interested, I don't think it explains its occurrence.

Why are folks getting all worked up over Bounce's question? Although his conclusion is completely wrong (IMO), he does have a valid question. That being: What was the main purpose of Wheaton posting up this public farewell thread?

I do not believe it was to recruit for any other forums as was supposed. Most everyone here who is the least bit passionate about their FJRs or motorcycles in general already participates in many of those other forums.

Was it alerting the other members to the strictness of certain moderators? I think that we all knew that already, and those that continue here for any length of time have accepted that as a part of the deal in participating here.

So, my gut feeling (and I think this is the only truly plausible explanation) is that Wheaton actually cares a lot about this forum and the people here, and he hoped that by stirring up the pot with a little high drama he might influence a change of some of the heavy handedness in the administration in the future.

Geezer talks about civil disobedience, and I agree whole-heartedly. I see Mark's grandiose announcement as just another form of protest. Sure one could just vote with their feet and quietly choose to not participate. And we all know that there have been many who have made that choice and done just that. But will anyone notice? Will anything ever change that way?

I received a private email just last week from (IMO) one of the most valuable forum regulars and a personal friend. Here's a guy that makes doodads and farkles for other FJR owners that can not be found anywhere else at any price, and sells them for nearly the cost of the materials and shipping (many may not realize that), so in essence he donates his spare time to the enjoyment of the FJR community. Those that have been around more than a few days know who I am talking about. In that private email he told me that he would not be posting here anymore due to continued run-ins with the admins. He will continue to make his farkles for his forum friends, but isn't willing to risk the personal abuse of pissing anyone off any more. This saddens me greatly.

I think we all appreciate that herding the cats on a forum the size and diversity of this one is a difficult and often thankless job. And we also all seem to appreciate that it is a job that needs to be done or else the forum would devolve into a chaotic mess of political and religious arguments, such as are rampant elsewhere on the intarwebs, that would not be worthy of the time and effort to participate in.

So yes, KJ, there does need to be rules in public societies, even out here on the wild, wild internet. And there needs to be sheriffs who administer those rules.

But, there also has to be some middle ground somewhere. Rules can be administered without the enforcers becoming personally insulting, derogatory or just plain nasty about it. Ask AJ (or any of the other policemen on the forum) what makes the difference between a good sheriff and an overzealous (I use that word because AJ loves it so much

) authoritarian. We all know that finding that kind of balance can not be easy. And I would encourage people on both sides of the fence to maintain level heads and make the required effort to work together towards our common goals.

If there are some things that you think should be changed around here, why not speak up and propose them? No, it is not a democracy here. And the members are merely guests. We can't just take a "pole" and expect the results to be automatically enacted. But, I believe that the forum admins and forum collective actually have identical goals, so why can't there be compromise and cooperation to achieve those goals?

very reasoned and constructive. i'll take my lumps and retract my assumption; going with Fred's supposition as being more positive. as said before, i publicly apologize for the assumption.

thanks for the constructive criticism.

 

[dj bill]

goddam you guys talk a lot.

 

[richsp51]

Wait a second...You're lying about your age? On the Internet?? I'm telling!!

You don't expect me to change nicks every time I have a birthday do you?

I thought that the "35" in Chuck35 referred to the year he was born!

 

[yamafitter]

This thread has made me mad enough to dig through the snow drift to my garage door and start up my FJR. In the meantime before it will be clear of salt & sand on the roads for a ride I'm booting every groundhog I see in the nuts because they said winter would be over a month ago.

 

[Fred W]

goddam you guys talk a lot.

A forum wouldn't be worth very much without conversation. It's kind of the entire point of having one.

Wait a second...You're lying about your age? On the Internet?? I'm telling!!

You don't expect me to change nicks every time I have a birthday do you?

I thought that the "35" in Chuck35 referred to the year he was born!

Ouch.