Critique - how I handled sand in a curve

[kolonial72]

Not sure that this is the right place to present this, but here goes.

A few days ago, I was taking a fairly leisurly ride through some familiar territory. I was in some hilly, twisty terrain approaching a right-hander posted 25 mph. Visibility around this curve is limited. I was going just under 30. As I entered the shadow of a tree right before I leaned in, I saw that sand had washed out across the entire road in the middle of the curve, which was also in the shadow. Mind you, this was the first time I'd seen wash-out on or near this curve. Anyway, there was little room for braking prior to leaning, and I try to stay off the brakes while leaned. So I decided to roll off the throttle a bit before the sand and then maintain RPM across the sand. Basically held speed to prevent too much torque being transmitted to the rear wheel in either the forward or reverse direction.

The rear tire stepped out to the left about 6 inches (that's a guess of course) when I hit the sand. Once traction was regained, the rear went back a bit right of center, then left a tad, then centered nicely. I'm not sure, but I think I rolled off the throttle some more when the rear went back to the right the first time. So after a well-deserved "Holy shit!" I went along my merry way.

As you will all no doubt recognize, a better answer would have been to see the sand earlier and then lower speed before the turn. For the sake of arguement, let's pretend this wasn't an option because it didn't happen. What suggestions would the experienced riders have for handling this kind of situation in the future?

 

[Texan]

Since your question is to experienced riders, I'll not comment except to say, if you kept the shiny side up, then you don't need much advice.

 

[wfooshee]

Panic and fall is about the only other thing I can think of, but I haven't had breakfast yet, so my mind isn't working well.

I've had the front slip out a bit in sand like that, and that certainly got my attention. My first crash was loosing the front in gravel, because I stared at the gravel when I saw it, and of course went right though it. Didn't have time to panic, just fell.

 

[Bounce]

1. Never out ride your sight line. If you're going too fast to react to things that suddenly appear around a corner, then you're going too fast (even if that's UNDER some numbers on a sign).

2. SLOW, look, lean, AND THEN roll (on the throttle).

3. Since there are no corner crews to keep things clean, you can't pretend it's a track. Adjust your speed downward accordingly. Just because it was one thing one time doesn't mean it will be the same even a few minutes later.

4. When all of the above are done and you see the sand, avoid (brake THEN swerve or swerve THEN brake - not both). The more upright you are when braking on the loose stuff, the higher probability you'll still be upright when it's all over. If you can't avoid, then get the bike as upright as possible as you go through the loose stuff.

5. Anything else is luck and reflex.

 

[Happy Rider]

Go very slow and try not to suck the seat up your ass as you pray the tires go back on line. Our roads around here seem to alway get sand and gravel kicked up in blind curves. I have to alway tell myself about the possible hidden hazards and resist hitting blind curves with much speed. If I'm feeling like I need to do some spirted riding I will ride the section first at a safe speed and look for hazards. I then go back and pick it up on the second, third, fourth pass. If you haven't ridden in the dirt on a dirt or dual sport its a good way to practice and get comfortable. I'm not the best rider and would sure like to hear more tips on this skill. Good topic.

 

[Leghorn]

I think you did absolutely the right thing by neutralizing the throttle. Additional suggestions would be to weight the pegs, even to the point of lifting slightly off the seat, and try to keep your arms relaxed. Both actions allow the bike to move around under the rider without transferring as much of the back-and-forth energy at the rear wheel to the rider's upper body.

 

[kolonial72]

As I indicated up front, +1 on the lower entry speed since my line-o'-sight did not cover the entire corner. I could have been more upright had I taken a different line, like straighten up in the sand and then lean again, but that did not occur to me in the moment.

I think you did absolutely the right thing by neutralizing the throttle. Additional suggestions would be to weight the pegs, even to the point of lifting slightly off the seat, and try to keep your arms relaxed. Both actions allow the bike to move around under the rider without transferring as much of the back-and-forth energy at the rear wheel to the rider's upper body.

I forgot to mention that my toes were on the pegs, and as a result, my upper body moved pretty much not at all.

5. Anything else is luck and reflex.

Precisely why I posted up. No rider should depend on luck and reflex, and I think that's at least a part of what got me through this one.

 

[JamesW]

No one mentioned sucking in the clutch and rolling through, I have done that on ice.

 

[UHOH]

It's tough for grown old eyes to see into shade, if you're in bright sunlight. Been there.

 

[bikerskier]

I usually ride with a push broom tied to the rack and when I see sand or gravel, I pull over and sweep it carefully off the road.

 

[Sticky Throttle]

1. Never out ride your sight line. If you're going too fast to react to things that suddenly appear around a corner, then you're going too fast (even if that's UNDER some numbers on a sign).2. SLOW, look, lean, AND THEN roll (on the throttle).

3. Since there are no corner crews to keep things clean, you can't pretend it's a track. Adjust your speed downward accordingly. Just because it was one thing one time doesn't mean it will be the same even a few minutes later.

4. When all of the above are done and you see the sand, avoid (brake THEN swerve or swerve THEN brake - not both). The more upright you are when braking on the loose stuff, the higher probability you'll still be upright when it's all over. If you can't avoid, then get the bike as upright as possible as you go through the loose stuff.

5. Anything else is luck and reflex.

+1 on everything above, but especially #4 "brake THEN swerve or swerve THEN brake - not both."

Anything you can do to go through something that robs you of traction, such as sand, in as much of an upright position (albeit temporarily) with neutral power is preferable.

 

[boomerang]

1. Never out ride your sight line. If you're going too fast to react to things that suddenly appear around a corner, then you're going too fast (even if that's UNDER some numbers on a sign).2. SLOW, look, lean, AND THEN roll (on the throttle).

3. Since there are no corner crews to keep things clean, you can't pretend it's a track. Adjust your speed downward accordingly. Just because it was one thing one time doesn't mean it will be the same even a few minutes later.

4. When all of the above are done and you see the sand, avoid (brake THEN swerve or swerve THEN brake - not both). The more upright you are when braking on the loose stuff, the higher probability you'll still be upright when it's all over. If you can't avoid, then get the bike as upright as possible as you go through the loose stuff.

5. Anything else is luck and reflex.

+1 on everything above, but especially #4 "brake THEN swerve or swerve THEN brake - not both."

Anything you can do to go through something that robs you of traction, such as sand, in as much of an upright position (albeit temporarily) with neutral power is preferable.

From the dirt to the street,do what ever you have to do to keep your front end under you and let the ass end do what it has to.

Sounds to me like what ever you did, you did it right or we would talking about your crash.

Every situation is unique and so much of it is instinctule,you just do what you have to,to stay upright.

lol Nothing like a little PUCKER BUTT to help keep the need for speed in check.

 

[JDog]

I had a very similar situation this past week. Fairly low speed but very tight right hand curve...hit the sand (NEVER saw it), back end kicked out and I actually (instinctually?) stuck my right leg out dirt bike style and recovered very quickly. Pretty scary as I don't ever recall putting my leg down on a corner like that.....Anyway, scuffed my new boots and got a nice little shot of adreneline but ultimately didn't make a complete ass of myself by dumping my ride at 25 mph!

 

[JohnB]

I would have to agree with both of the previous posts. Dirt biking experience would have me weight the front wheel as much as possible by sliding forward on the seat and sticking a leg out with the hope of proping it up if it began to fall in. I'm not sure how well that would work with a 650 pound street bike though.

 

[JDog]

I would have to agree with both of the previous posts. Dirt biking experience would have me weight the front wheel as much as possible by sliding forward on the seat and sticking a leg out with the hope of proping it up if it began to fall in. I'm not sure how well that would work with a 650 pound street bike though.

Well, I should add that I did end up with a mild, right-side groin pull after that little episode.....it's not a YZ 250 folks!

 

[Lionswings]

I had the same thing happen to me in a 35 mph corner. I was following a buddy doing 55mph and he failed to give the warning sign of the gravel in the corner. He took a line that didn't hit it but I didn't see it in time. Lucky for me there was no oncoming traffic. I pulled in the clutch, straightened up and rode through across it into the oncoming lane. Growing up on dirt bikes I have sat on the tank and put my foot down several times. But like others said, not sure how affective that is with a 650 pound bike but I guess I do it from habit. If you can out sunny side up, you did good.

PS: I do think that one of the reasons I hit that gravel was because of what Wfooshee said...I was looking at it.

 

[sergeantnic]

You can apply brakes while leaned over. Was the sand over the entire surface of the road? If not, the ideal thing to do is apply brakes then swerve around the obstacle.

 

[ctfjr]

I had a very similar situation this past week. Fairly low speed but very tight right hand curve...hit the sand (NEVER saw it), back end kicked out and I actually (instinctually?) stuck my right leg out dirt bike style and recovered very quickly. Pretty scary as I don't ever recall putting my leg down on a corner like that.....Anyway, scuffed my new boots and got a nice little shot of adreneline but ultimately didn't make a complete ass of myself by dumping my ride at 25 mph!

I did the same thing several years ago on a GL1800. My son & I were riding the badlands in South Dakota when I entered a turn only to discover tar snakes everywhere. I managed to cleverly get maneuvered right onto one. The back end did a kick out instantly and the bike started to lowside. I also instinctively put my foot down. My son, riding behind me, was sure I must have broken my leg. As soon as the rear caught traction the bike popped right up.

I also don't even remember putting my foot down but all's well that ends well