WOTL: Gen 2="safe and sane"? Gen 1= jekyll/hyde?

[GhidorahX]

Finally got my new to me 09er out of town for some play time . . . overall I'm very happy with the capability of the bike . . . but I'm not quite as happy with the throttle transitions on/off in tight canyon riding--I posted a few questions on the "herky-jerky throttle" thread--and got some responses there. Some recommended the PowerCommander V with mapping for smoothness; but my mechanic buddy says, "If it breaks you'll be screwed, better to keep the stock mapping" . . . so for now that's what I'm doing. I'm having to learn to be in a lower gear than I need to use on my old Konk . . . which comparatively is much smoother in the canyon.

But, question . . . is the whole "Gen 1 v Gen 2" debate about the difference in FI mapping, such that the Gen 1 is more mild to wild--Jekyll/Hyde? and the Gen 2 is more well mannered, safe/sane? The 09er seems to more "grow" into its speed than "zipper" into it . . . is that the nature of the beast? I can't tell if the relative low mileage, 13K +-, means that the engine isn't loosened up yet, or the throttle springs are still "young" . . . and makes it harder to turn the throttle . . . ??? I don't have major need for top end speed, but, for humor, . . . a bit more "zip" would keep it interesting . . . . The other day a GS also riding two-up more or less left me for dead from a stop sign . . . feel like I should have been able to get closer with the raging 13 . . . but seemed to "not feel like it"????

Any way to have the OEM maps changed to Gen 1, if that is what is going on?

GX

 

[bluesdog]

The Unauthorized TBS may help some in off/on throttle transition. Afaik, there's no way to re-map the ECU to Gen I, and I don't think it would help even if there were.

Being a control freak, I installed a PCV and auto-tune to my Gen II, and eventually developed a suitable map -- although there wasn't a whole lot of 'snatchiness' to start with.

I can't compare it to other bikes -- most around here ride cruisers, so don't offer much competition.

I'm still reluctant to WOT in first, and the front wheel will come up pretty easily in second...

HTH

 

[mcatrophy]

Unwinding the centre throttle spring will help control a bit, try this post. If you want to lift the tank, remember to slacken the rear fastener, not mentioned in the original post, shown in my post lower down in that topic.

 

[Redfish Hunter]

I am at a loss here. The jerky throttle issues were mostly confined to the '06 and '07 models, they are mostly fixed with the PC-V.

I have no idea what your mechanic buddy means by "if it breaks you'll be screwed." If the PC-V breaks, just remove it.

I have a lot of respect for the BMW GS. I am sure it is a great bike. I know that it runs well. I don't think it should be able to outrun an FJR in a straight line. Out corner it maybe, not beat it in a drag race.

Perhaps something else is wrong here?

 

[wfooshee]

I think he means if the motor breaks, you're screwed, because you messed with it.

The '06 and '07 are the ones that had the goofy-shaped throttle tube. Beyond that I don't know what's up. There was a gearing change to a taller overall drive ratio, but I think that was mid-Gen-I, not a Gen-I/Gen-II thing. Not sure about that. But having a taller gear than you're used to, with everything else feeling the same, could be why it's more "sedate."

As for putting Gen-I OEM maps in.... no.

 

[HotRodZilla]

A couple things:

90% of my throttle transition issues were solved with properly adjusting the throttle cables. Make sure yours don't have too much play. Throttle abruptness has never been an issue on my '07, but that's my feel and my opinion. That was supposedly fixed from '08 and beyond. Most don't have many complaints about those years.

The most common throttle fixes are G2 throttle cams, and PC3s or PC-Vs. All those units do is adjust fuel. They can't really "break" anything. If something goes wonky, all you gotta do is disconnect it, which takes like 15 minutes. Most of that time is getting to it.

As far as speed goes, remember, these bikes get very strong in the higher revs. It took me a while to realize this thing likes the higher revs, as I came from a bike that red-lined around 5k. With the FJR, the fun is just starting at 5k.

Lastly, my bike became a different creature after 20k. More "loose" and everything just seemed to flow better. Engine feel, transmission workings and all seemed to finally break in.

Good luck

 

[GhidorahX]

Gents:

Appreciate the replies, for some reason there was no "notification" on replies . . . maybe I forgot to add something??? Anyway, perhaps "taller gearing" might explain what I'm experiencing . . . haven't looked at the specs in comparo to the Concours. So far I have not taken the bike to redline in any gear . . . really no room for that around LA . . . just too many LEOs waiting for people to "act frisky" . . . very expensive. But, sure, 5K is pretty routine in the normal rev range . . . so far, everything seems very well-behaved . . . no hints of untapped wildness waiting to be unleashed . . . just sturdy competence with very nice cornering behaviors.

And, thanks for the other thoughts on the PCV . . . I wouldn't know whether my mechanic buddy knows that if you remove the PCV, the bike reverts to stock mapping w/o a hiccup . . . or not. Or whether it would have to be "re-mapped" . . . he was referring to roadside fixes . . . of course, "15 minutes" is almost nothing . . . .

But, also thanks on the 20K+ for the "break-in" . . . that's sort of what I'm wondering . . . it still feels a tad "clumsy" on the moving away from a full stop . . . .

Gx

 

[Redfish Hunter]

The PC-V does not actually change anything in the ECU, it is does not re-program or alter the ECU in any way. It fits between the ECU and the injectors. You simply unplug the cables that lead from the ECU to the injectors, at the injectors. The PC-V cables plug in there. The PC-V then takes the signal from the ECU and puts its own spin on the signal to the injector. Unplugging the PC-V and re-connecting the cables puts everything back to original.

Of course, you must also unplug the O2 sensor for proper results and that must be re-connected.

Not all of the '06 and '07 FJRs behaved badly and some owners just learned to deal with it or ride around the problems. My Dad's '07 was terrible and he was not able to overcome it. The PC-V and the G2 Throttle Tamer fixed that. YMMV.

 

[GhidorahX]

Unwinding the centre throttle spring will help control a bit, try this post. If you want to lift the tank, remember to slacken the rear fastener, not mentioned in the original post, shown in my post lower down in that topic.

@mcatrophy: Read through those posts . . . thanks for that; same to Hotrod zilla for the "adjust the throttle cables" advice. The idea of letting a little tension off the spring might handle the problem . . . make it a little easier to turn the throttle, etc.

@redfish: Thanks for the details on the PCV . . . doesn't seem like a "destructive" modification, not outrageously expensive . . . .

GX

 

[TomInPA]

So glad I already own the superior Gen I and don't have to worry about this crap. I just go for a ride, and don't think about it.

 

[GPRIDER]

Ah yes, the old Gen I nut roaster.

 

[GhidorahX]

Right . . . there is no single "perfect" motorcycle . . . always a little something that coulda/shoulda be this way or that . . . . FJR is pretty close, a tad more wind protection . . . a little more luggage space . . . but, great, great brakes . . . great handling . . . and, right, not a nut roaster . . . . And hopefuly I'll get this throttle situation straightened out . . . a few thousand miles to go to the next service interval . . . .

GX

 

[DennisJ]

My '09 has a little surge just off idle that I think is probably the transition from idle to open throttle and I still find it a little irritating. The rest of performance is so good that I am willing to accept this little "jerk or surge". I haven't tried to verify that the front wheel will come off the ground if the throttle is opened rapidly in 1st; lots of reports by others that it will. I know the front wheel gets very light in 2nd when the throttle is opened rapidly and I have no desire to test the ability to "wheelie" in 1st gear.

 

[GhidorahX]

@DennisJ:

Thanks for the post on yr '09 . . . right, overall, going down the road, performance is fine. This "let some tension off the return spring" idea is interesting and worth looking into. But, right, the "transition" on the FI is the "issue" . . . I'm mostly experiencing something like when the FI "senses" idle or zero throttle . . . it doesn't "allow" acceleration for a brief or not so brief . . . amount of time . . . and then it will "surge" as more throttle is applied, in the attempt to get the computer to "send fuel" . . . . Can it be "worked around"?? Sure, but . . . seems like it should work "more better" than it seems to???

But, not really looking for raising the front wheel . . . just the "right amount" of power to smoothly pull away from a stop light, easy pull on cables . . . such that the GS was not leaving me in the dust. Possibly he was trying to impress his GF and was really hammering it . . . didn't see massive "squating" of his suspension . . . and I wasn't trying to initiate a "contest of speed" . . . just seems like it shoulda been "closer" . . . but, really wasn't . . . the space dragon was left behind . . . ???? But gas mileage was "excellent" . . . . : - 0

GX

 

[HotRodZilla]

@DennisJ:
Thanks for the post on yr '09 . . . right, overall, going down the road, performance is fine. This "let some tension off the return spring" idea is interesting and worth looking into. But, right, the "transition" on the FI is the "issue" . . . I'm mostly experiencing something like when the FI "senses" idle or zero throttle . . . it doesn't "allow" acceleration for a brief or not so brief . . . amount of time . . . and then it will "surge" as more throttle is applied, in the attempt to get the computer to "send fuel" . . . . Can it be "worked around"?? Sure, but . . . seems like it should work "more better" than it seems to???

But, not really looking for raising the front wheel . . . just the "right amount" of power to smoothly pull away from a stop light, easy pull on cables . . . such that the GS was not leaving me in the dust. Possibly he was trying to impress his GF and was really hammering it . . . didn't see massive "squating" of his suspension . . . and I wasn't trying to initiate a "contest of speed" . . . just seems like it shoulda been "closer" . . . but, really wasn't . . . the space dragon was left behind . . . ???? But gas mileage was "excellent" . . . . : - 0

GX

Am I the only one that has no idea WTF he is talking about? Jesus dude, chill on the excessive punctuation and concentrate on English. I think you're saying you have poor throttle control of your FJR and got smoked by a BMW GS at a light. This indicates issues beyond your writing skills.

 

[beemerdons]

So glad I already own the superior Gen I and don't have to worry about this crap. I just go for a ride, and don't think about it.

+1, Gunny; muchas gracias mi Amigo Tomaso, finally a Voice of Reason on this thread and irrefutable proof of why TominCA is the smartest man on our Fine FJR Forum!

 

[HotRodZilla]

^^^Coming from a guy who abandoned his GenI on the side of a lonely highway for the temptations of a GenIII. What a loser!!

 

[rushes]

I wanna know what bike you had that let you know what perfection felt like.

I've never felt it. I've always had to adjust....

I think you need a BMW....

 

[beemerdons]

I wanna know what bike you had that let you know what perfection felt like.

I've never felt it. I've always had to adjust....

I think you need a BMW....

Actually Russ when I gave Cameron Diaz a ride on my Vespa 150 it was perfect, well at least perfect enough for this Decrepit Old Fart! jes' sayin' and nuff said, Geritol!