2007 waits until water pump failure doesn't create a disaster

[soderstromk]

Friday I rode from Greenville, NC to Chapel Hill for a weekend conference. After the meeting and getting everything all packed-up, gear on, start while putting on helmet, look down in front of the right foot peg and see an evaporated drop of rust, and then follow up a streak or two of rust to the water pump intake hose bib. I very gently pulled on the hose and it came right off and coolant (that had seen better days) started shooting out so I pushed the hose what I thought at the time was back on. I assumed that it had just become loose and/or the clamp holding it on had failed.

It stopped leaking and so I decided if it fell off I'd just push it back on again and hope I didn't run out of coolant until I made it home - about 110 miles.

I'd stopped once for gas and by the time I got home decided it could wait until a free weekend day to deal with. I was trying to put off flushing coolant until valve check. I'm going to be busy until about May and am planning to tackle valves then.

I started it up this morning to warm up and it started leaking steadily. I had to get to work so I just turned it off and rode the Versys.

Back home this evening I had realized I had to deal with it immediately, but still thought it was something like a corroded intake hose or clamp. I loosened fairings up enough to remove the radiator cap, went around to the right side and pinched the intake hose between thumb and forefinger and it just came off with virtually no pressure at all.

After racing for a bucket and allowing the stream to slow to a slow drip I removed the drain plug and repeated the process and then removed the cover and two big hoses.

It turns-out the hose barb itself has corroded, and it appears to be a press fit into the cover casting. I'll add pix.

I suspect I could cheaply fabricate a replacement hose barb and epoxy it in. But I think it would take about half a day to get this done properly, and it always takes twice as long as you think. So I'm just going to replace parts. Hopefully the hose barb itself is available. If not I suppose I'm looking at significant $ for the cover.

But I have to say, this thing got me home when it could have given out in a much w

 

[harper]

Glad you made it home. That barb looks like it's corroded below the surface of the water pump cover. Are you certain that it's just pressed in? I appreciate the challenge of manufacturing a new barb and pressing it in but I think you would first have to bore out the pump cover to clean out the mating surface and make the barb oversized in the press region. Seems like a lot of work. How much does the pump cover cost and how much is your time worth? That's the question I ask myself before I start down a rabbit hole like this one.

 

[2GENAE]

I would replace the pump with a Gen III vs purchasing parts to repair it. I went thru this on my 2008 and realized Yamaha only sold replacement parts for Gen I/II. Then looked at new Gen III for parts and realized Yamaha sold a complete pump assembly. I found a 2018 pump Ebay 21,000 miles $50 I used my 2008 cover so paint matched purchased new O ring for input shaft in crankcase and new formed O ring case cover. I used O ring lube on the O ring for the input shaft. I flushed the system with distilled water installed new 50/50 antifreeze for aluminum engines. That was 3 years ago and 15,000 miles no issues.

 

[tschutter]

Close call. You must be 'living right'.

 

[RossKean]

@2GENAE has it right

I just had a look at Partzilla on-line.

I looked at Gen II water pump parts (2011) and the housing cover (5JW-12422-10-00) is $126.46
https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/yamaha/motorcycle/2011/fjr1300a-fjr13aas/water-pump
Gen III (2015) lists the entire waterpump assembly (1MC-12420-01-00) for $176.97
https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/yamaha/motorcycle/2015/fjr1300a-fjr13afc/water-pump
It is my understanding that they are interchangeable between Gen II and Gen III+. Possible exception of paint color. (You could always paint it with a close rattle can match or use the outer cover from your existing pump if a color difference bothered you...)
(someone correct me if I am wrong)

$126.46 to refurbish a 16 year old pump vs $176.97 for a brand new one? It would be a no-brainer for me.

 

[soderstromk]

Glad you made it home. That barb looks like it's corroded below the surface of the water pump cover. Are you certain that it's just pressed in? I appreciate the challenge of manufacturing a new barb and pressing it in but I think you would first have to bore out the pump cover to clean out the mating surface and make the barb oversized in the press region. Seems like a lot of work. How much does the pump cover cost and how much is your time worth? That's the question I ask myself before I start down a rabbit hole like this one.

Pump cover = $125. O-ring = $9. From the schematic on the Yamaha website it isn't clear that the hose barb is included in the cover - so fingers crossed.
The barb does look like it was pressed in. I don't see any evidence of remnants left in the hole it came from, so I think whatever is missing just corroded to particles. I've got a lathe and some aluminum stock and so if the replacement cover doesn't have what I need I'll make a replacement and epoxy it in to make sure it stays. And then cross my fingers. I've been lucky so far.

 

[soderstromk]

@2GENAE has it right

I just had a look at Partzilla on-line.

I looked at Gen II water pump parts (2011) and the housing cover (5JW-12422-10-00) is $126.46
https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/yamaha/motorcycle/2011/fjr1300a-fjr13aas/water-pump
Gen III (2015) lists the entire waterpump assembly (1MC-12420-01-00) for $176.97
https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/yamaha/motorcycle/2015/fjr1300a-fjr13afc/water-pump
It is my understanding that they are interchangeable between Gen II and Gen III+. Possible exception of paint color. (You could always paint it with a close rattle can match or use the outer cover from your existing pump if a color difference bothered you...)
(someone correct me if I am wrong)

$126.46 to refurbish a 16 year old pump vs $176.97 for a brand new one? It would be a no-brainer for me.

Damn. I ordered the cover before seeing your post of the correct way to fix this. I suppose I could return it for the cost of shipping...

 

[soderstromk]

Other than it being a bit of a PITA...would it be a bad idea to try to cut a gasket to replace the O-ring?

 

[torch]

The elephant in the room is "What have you been using for antifreeze?" My son has my '03, 330,000 kms or more. Been through 2 waterpump seals, never seen that kind of corrosion!

 

[soderstromk]

Recently purchased. Changed all fluids except for coolant - bc wanted to do with valves. Plan on valves this spring.
Hopefully the radiator and rest of the cooling system isn't also on the way out.

 

[RossKean]

Damn. I ordered the cover before seeing your post of the correct way to fix this. I suppose I could return it for the cost of shipping...

I would!

My son has my '03, 330,000 kms or more. Been through 2 waterpump seals, never seen that kind of corrosion!!

I haven't encountered corrosion either. I sold my '07 with 295,000 km and currently have 160,000 km on my 2011 and never had to do anything with a waterpump on either (other than tighten up a hose clamp a quarter turn after I noticed a very slow leak). Never even had to replace a seal. I did have the radiator repaired on the '07 at one point and I had to replace the plastic overflow tank which became very brittle and cracked at something around 200,000 km. No apparent corrosion or encrustation in the waterpump, inside the radiator, around the cover or thermostat. (I think the radiator leak was due to a manufacturing flaw)

Be sure to replace the two o-rings on the coolant pipe when you do your valve check. They WILL leak if you re-use them.
Check the plastic overflow tank for brittleness.

 

[soderstromk]

There clearly is much corrosion in my cooling system. Hopefully fresh anti-freeze will be enough to preserve it. Maybe a good idea to prophylactically add some Bar's Leaks?
I fabricated a replacement hose barb out of aluminum rod and epoxied it in. Couldn't find gasket material after three stops and with holiday traffic I was done trying. I might reassemble with the old O-ring and see what happens. I'll return the replacement cover and if the redneck fix becomes a problem order a entire pump assembly as was wisely recommended.

 

[soderstromk]

I'm going through withdrawal not having this rideable. The Versys is like riding a tractor.

 

[RossKean]

I wouldn't add a leak stop product. A band-aid at best.

 

[an-guy]

I'm going through withdrawal not having this rideable. The Versys is like riding a tractor.

I rode a brand new versys 650 at the demo day a couple weeks ago.

Holy freaking hell, I've never been so eager to get back on my own old ass bike. I could whine about that 12,600$ bike for a while...

 

[soderstromk]

My Versys is the 300 X...
To it's credit it does go off road. But it could renew the market for riding crops getting to the trail.

 

[harper]

I fabricated a replacement hose barb out of aluminum rod and epoxied it in.

Which epoxy did you use? JB Weld did OK for me with hot water at 70psig on a water heater. Granted, the temperature was probably under 130F.

 

[soderstromk]

Yes, JB Weld. It was a pretty good press fit too: I had to tap it in with a hammer.

 

[RossKean]

Which epoxy did you use? JB Weld did OK for me with hot water at 70psig on a water heater. Granted, the temperature was probably under 130F.

JB Weld claims OK for temperatures up to 500°F (260°C) - even higher for short intervals. I expect it softens a bit before that point but should be safe at waterpump temperatures indefinitely. Glycol probably won't bother it.

If there is evidence of significant corrosion, I might make the repair to tide me over but I would still replace the entire pump. I would have a good look at the radiator, cap and thermostat as well. Examine hoses for cracks and bulges. (When my expansion tank became embrittled, cracked and leaked, I did a temporary repair using "Seal-All" and fibreglas cloth, but only as long as I needed to get the replacement.) A cracked expansion tank or a radiator pinhole will result in a slow loss of coolant whereas a hole in the waterpump (especially on the pressure side) could piss out the entire cooling system content in minutes.

 

[soderstromk]

I got it all buttoned-up and up to fan temperature without any new parts other than the fabricated hose barb. I didn't ride it because it started raining and got dark. But all *seems* stable for now.

Everything about it shows signs of rust and corrosion. I'll be very surprised if it continues on without issues. I flushed it with 2 gallons of distilled water. It was rusty for the first half gallon, brownish for the remainder and pretty-much clear for the second gallon.

I could only get about 2 qts of 50:50 antifreeze in.

Time will tell...

But thanks for all of your help! It's good to know there are experts willing to share just a log-on away.