maybe a weird question about tires

[Eric L]

Just had the shop install my 5th set of tires. I noticed that there are no wheel weights on the rims. None. I asked them about this and they said, it didnt need any.

Does that sound right to you? Of course now I convinced myself I can feel a new vibration, but it might just be the power of obsession

 

[TomInPA]

I've had it happen, but never on both rims. The FJR usually does not take a lot of weight to balance, but the only way to know is to remove the wheel and check it. If you remove your own wheels, I would think the shop will verify the balance for you. Good luck Eric.

 

[Ignacio]

Both? That's fairly unusual....depending on tire brand if they mark the heavy spot.

If you feel a vibration at lower speeds...it would magnify at higher speeds. Test it out if you're not sure.

 

[a.droid]

I used Balance beads in mine. But that does not sound like what the shops saying

 

[Fred W]

As others have said: Yes, sometimes if you know and match the light spot of the tire to the heavy spot of the rim you get lucky and don't need any weight. It happens maybe 5 percent of the time if you are using a brand that balance marks their tires and also take the added step of finding the heavy spot of the bare rim. Shops do not generally do the latter step and will just slap the tire on with the light spot mark aligned at the valve stem, which BTW would be exactly the worst place to put it on my FJR rear wheel.

Michelin does not mark for balance at all. My success rate for mounting Michelins with no weight is approximately zero, and I've mounted a whole bunch of them. (probably a dozen of my own and another 20 or so for other people)

The likelihood that the shop got two tires mounted that needed no weight at all is infinitely small. OTOH, the likelihood that the shop monkey they hired to change tires forgot to balance them is quite a bit greater in comparison. The possibility that they are lying now to cover up shoddy work would encourage me to go elsewhere to have them checked, especially if you feel some road vibration at speed.

 

[kenporider]

Unlike Fred, I've had several Michelin's balance perfectly without the need for weight, but not so much with other brands (customer bikes, not mine). Typically, from what I've experienced, a rim like the FJR will need about .25-.50oz on the front and .50-.75oz on the rear on average. Some shops consider a tire balanced if it's within .25oz, which could be the case but I think it's more likely that they forgot to balance it. Whomever told you it didn't need any most likely isn't the person who worked on it.

 

[Bounce]

When doing my own, I was able to play with the PR2s and get them spot on with a static balancer. That's why I roll my eyes on shop installs that use an ounce or more.

 

[FJR-Pilot]

Bottom line: if you feel vibration ... one or both wheels are not balanced correctly. Take it up to 60 or 70 and let go of the handle bars - that will tell you something about the front. When my front tires have been out of balance it shakes noticeably.

 

[Top_Speed1]

One of my big-ass, wide-glide buddies just picked up a Weaver M807X and a Parnes balancer for his garage tinkering. I went over to "practice" with him a couple of weeks ago and we mounted and balanced tires for 5 bikes (4 sporties, 1 Fatboy). It's funny how they all show-up for "free" tire mounting night. Most didn't know we were rookies using them as subjects. So.... maybe we just suck ass (and I'm sure we do compared to some here!) but we had at least some kind of weights on all 9 tires (1 dude was a rear only). In reality, that changer is so slick, a blind man could of done it (OK, we maybe are in that category after a few Rolling Rocks)

Now as Fred mentioned- aligning up with the heavy side of the rim to the light side of the tire?? that is probably about a 12-pak shy of what we could possibly achieve. Hey, it was fun changing the tires but way more fun drinking beers afterwards!

So, next year maybe we'll learn that trick... maybe

 

[Wlfman]

Unlike Fred, I've had several Michelin's balance perfectly without the need for weight, but not so much with other brands (customer bikes, not mine). Typically, from what I've experienced, a rim like the FJR will need about .25-.50oz on the front and .50-.75oz on the rear on average. Some shops consider a tire balanced if it's within .25oz, which could be the case but I think it's more likely that they forgot to balance it. Whomever told you it didn't need any most likely isn't the person who worked on it.

Yep. I balanced my wheels without tires on them. Now I RARELY need to add any additional weights, especially with Michelins.

 

[Bounce]

Good point. Balancing (or at least marking the heavy spot of) the rim (with the new valve stem installed) first helps the process.

 

[mdisher]

Michelin does not mark for balance at all. My success rate for mounting Michelins with no weight is approximately zero, and I've mounted a whole bunch of them. (probably a dozen of my own and another 20 or so for other people)

I believe that they do, the small barcode sticker on the beat is supposed to be mounted at the valve stem. That's what we were told by a Michelin guy at a BMWMOA tiretalk thing a while back.

In the past I have just balanced the rim, and done that and it was fine. That said, on my last two sets of tires, I had a vibration. I recently pull the front wheel, and rebalanced it with the tire on, and ended up removing the 3 weights (.75 oz?) that was on the front and moved added back 1 .25 weight about 90 degrees off.

None of that information probably matters to anyone else but there you have it.

-MD

 

[Bounce]

I've used the bar code sticker as the marker but assuming it goes to the stem is assuming the stem is the heavy part of the rim. I marked the heavy point of the rim (with stem installed) and lined the bar code up with the mark (not the stem on either rim). But yeah, that's the idea.

 

[Fred W]

I've balanced a number of bar FJR rims. They do not all have their light spots at the same places. Mine is right near the valve stem, others have been pretty randomly distributed. And of course if you have a TPMS the heavy spot will be at the stem because the pressure transducer will be mounted there.

When I balance the bare wheel I mark the weight on the inside for future reference, but I don't leave the balance weights on the wheel. That would be counter the objective of having the least balance weights possible. Al you really need to know is that if the tire mounts and balances with more weight at the same spot that the rim is light, it's time to rotate the tire around the rim 180 degrees and balance again.

That never happens on balance marked tires, It has happened on Michelins

I too have tried using the barcode as the light balance spot, (which means putting it opposite the stem on my wheel).

In a few cases it seemed to have "worked", but in others the light spot just ended up being somewhere else (neither the rim nor the wheel's light spot). I've come to the conclusion that the barcode is just a barcode, not a balance mark at all.

YMMV

PS - Michelin has a pretty good web page on motorcycle tires including suggestions on mounting and balancing their tires. They do not mention alignment of any balance marks or barcodes there

 

[mdisher]

In a few cases it seemed to have "worked", but in others the light spot just ended up being somewhere else (neither the rim nor the wheel's light spot).

And that may very well be the case for me. Maybe I just got "Lucky" on a few changes and it was "good enough/close enough" that I didn't feel any issues and it caught up with me on the last two changes.

I'll do the same thing next time, leave the weights, line up the barcode in the same way, then rebalance and see what's what.

-MD

 

[Eric L]

well I went and road it 150 miles today, i really dont feel anything getting worse and worse at speed (up to ~100). For sure, when the front tire is worn badly, the front end wobbles when i take hands off bars and decelerate. It isnt doing that at all now.

I thin k the next bike i buy is going to bought based on the shop having a good service department.

 

[Wlfman]

I thin k the next bike i buy is going to bought based on the shop having a good service department.

Invest in some tools and time and do your own service. Then it doesn't matter what bike you own. As you'll be the Service Dept and you'll know it was done right.

 

[Ignacio]

I thin k the next bike i buy is going to bought based on the shop having a good service department.

Invest in some tools and time and do your own service. Then it doesn't matter what bike you own. As you'll be the Service Dept and you'll know it was done right.

I agree and I have a good service department available. Tire changing equipment was an extremely good investment (including balancer and box of weights) as I've paid for it 4 or 5 times over, and made changing rubber very convenient for me.

 

[captaincautious]

Even if they feel fine and since they are new tires, I would still suggest using some of the Balance beads as already stated above. Super easy to install and they are cheap insurance against any type of balancing problem and abnormal tire wear. They have made a big difference especially with my fronts where cupping was an issue. Thanks