Brake Useage Discussion

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Front break to slow and stop.

Rear brake to steer and stop.

Get yourself an XR80 and go play in the dirt. You'll learn more in a short time than most riding courses will ever teach you.

 
Brakes... who uses those.. make that gear box sing!!!! Naw just jerking you uptight ones. :D

Really.. this is a good thread that BE started. Lots of good info on technique and styles that newer riders can get some info on, especially the ex cruiser guys who are used to thinking ..never use the front brake, you flip, or lock the rear and dump it instead. <_<

 
I mostly use the front brakes. I use the rear in gravel and trail-braking when doing slow, tight turns... like the figure 8 in the MSF course.
I have a friend who is a CHP and is getting ready to go to Motor Officer school (probably not the official name). We had a discussion about the rear brake for slow speed manuering. It is something that I need to work on.

 
Brakes... who uses those.. make that gear box sing!!!! Naw just jerking you uptight ones. :D
Really.. this is a good thread that BE started. Lots of good info on technique and styles that newer riders can get some info on, especially the ex cruiser guys who are used to thinking ..never use the front brake, you flip, or lock the rear and dump it instead. <_<
Thank you. My problem is that all of my riding has been all sportbike oriented, so I am coming from that place. Most of my riding, even now, would be considered sport riding. Hey, look where I live! Great roads are right outside my back door! I look at sport touring as sportriding with extra socks and underwear!

 
Hey, look where I live! Great roads are right outside my back door! I look at sport touring as sportriding with extra socks and underwear!
Yeah, Jeff, go right ahead. Rub it in, willya? ;) ;) ;)

Stef

 
I have exactly the same brakes on my FJR, and I don't think that they are that far off. Granted, I'm stopping an additional 130-140 pounds more motorcycle, but not that bad.
My '04 R1 has radial brakes and 320mm rotors, whereas the FJR (2003) only has 296mm rotors and the older style, side mounted calipers from '03 and back R1 & R6. I can tell ya, those smaller brakes aren't enough for me! lol It's going to be an upgrade for me for sure to at least get the 320mm rotors and have relocation brackets made! Majority of my riding experience comes from sportbikes also. I'm not advocating not using rear brake, just not my style. Might have to revamp that thinking if I can't get the FJR to slow better. Doesn't stop bad, just not what I'm used to is all. I personally believe though that if you have time to think about braking with the rear, you have time to maneuver. Target fixation and panic are you enemy! Just my opinion is all! :D

 
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Hey, look where I live! Great roads are right outside my back door! I look at sport touring as sportriding with extra socks and underwear!
Yeah, Jeff, go right ahead. Rub it in, willya? ;) ;) ;)

Stef
You have nothing to be jealous about! I would KILL to be able to tour italy on the FJR! You better not give me a way to blackmail you.

 
Wow, this is a great thread. Lots of good discussion.

I learned to ride in the dirt, in fact my first 5 years of riding were all dirt since I was too young to drive. The rear brake is indispensable on a dirt bike, just like a street bike, IMO.

One thing I'd like to point out that's been hinted at here - if you close the throttle to reduce speed after entering a corner, you are braking with the rear wheel. Only difference is you're using the engine as a braking force instead of the rear brake itself. This is somewhat more true on the track, where corner entry RPM is generally higher, hence more engine braking force is available. So, on the street, when we are usually using a higher gear and lower corner entry rpm, a little bit of brake can be useful, as described:

I do blow corner entry speeds. When I do, I brake. I brake because I'm "guessing" I'm not going to be able to successfully get through this corner at this speed, or that if I do I will have used up all my margin for this event of the corner, and there darned well could be other things in this unknown Street corner that likely would not be there on some corner of a well known race track.
Amen, bro - well said.
I am a volunteer corner worker, have been for many years now. The track is a controlled environment, with a trained crew out there to ensure the track is clean and in good condition, and an ambulance and medical professionals at the ready. Crashing is a well planned event. That's one major difference with the street - it could literally take 15-30 minutes -or more- for help to arrive. The street demands that a greater margin of safety be applied for this and many other reasons.

Having said all this, I also do the vast majority of my braking with the front - but I use the rear brake sometimes just for practice, so I have a feel for how it works. You never can tell.....

 
I learned on an old BMW, and had a Nighthawk S circa 1984. The shafts would rise and fall constantly, so I have the (bad) habit of trail braking on both the FJR and FZ. Not much, but a habit just the same.

 
Does anybody have tips on getting maximum braking potential out of the rear tire during (non-abs) panic braking? The reason I ask is that every now and then I do the emergency stop practice routine but I hate to do it too much, because I end up locking up the rear almost every time, which scrubs off a good amount of rubber on that spot, which results in uneven tire wear. I almost always use the front and rear brakes simultaneously, so that part is intuitive. But I think my problem is that during the panic braking routine, the weight on the rear tire is so little that it becomes much easier to lock up than it is during more routine braking, such as approaching a corner or other planned stops/slow downs. I know I need more practice at it, but I'd like to learn of any tips that would help me quickly develop a feel for knowing when the rear is about to lock up during quick stops.

 
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It's going to be an upgrade for me for sure to at least get the 320mm rotors and have relocation brackets made! Majority of my riding experience comes from sportbikes also. I'm not advocating not using rear brake, just not my style. Might have to revamp that thinking if I can't get the FJR to slow better. Doesn't stop bad, just not what I'm used to is all.
Different bikes. Different skill sets. Part of moving between bikes is learning their limits and personalities.

 
Does anybody have tips on getting maximum braking potential out of the rear tire during (non-abs) panic braking?
I'd start by practicing some panic stops without the front brake. Do this to get a feel for the performance of the rear brake without having to concentrate on the front. Don't concern yourself with stopping distance in this exercise, be more concerned with finding the traction limit of the rear brake. Once you have a feel for this, start adding front brake, and keep adding more to get a feel for how it changes rear traction. Finally, go back to full panic stops trying to minimize stopping distance, BUT not letting the rear brake lock up. If it does happen to lock, you should now be able to modulate it during braking, just like the front. I've done panic stops where I've momentarily locked and released the rear wheel a few times, depending on available traction. The key is learning to control both brakes at the same time, which is not that difficult. Anyone who can use the clutch and throttle at the same time can learn to use both brakes and modulate them individually.

 
That sounds like a heckuva good idea WJ! Honestly, why did I not think of that? :dribble: Thanks for the suggestion. I'll work on that approach this weekend.

 
Every once in a while I ride with a fellow FJR rider and I have to say he is quite quick and smooth. We did 12 hours of twisties last weekend and I saw his brake lights come on maybe twice the entire time.

-r

 
Every once in a while I ride with a fellow FJR rider and I have to say he is quite quick and smooth. We did 12 hours of twisties last weekend and I saw his brake lights come on maybe twice the entire time.
-r
Were you following me again ?? :D

 
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