lele
Well-known member
Do u think a 2016 OEM rear shock is better than an Ohlins?
does it fit every generation ?
does it fit every generation ?
Replaced Gen II shock with a Gen III shock
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Just to be clear, Partshark is a different outfit than Partzilla. Partzilla is the same outfit as Boats.com. Partshark is not related to them.
No. The 2016 OEM shock is still an OEM shock. It has a single damping adjuster on the bottom of the shock that primarily adjusts the rebound damping, but may also affect the compression damping somewhat. There is a soft/hard lever to lock out the soft section of the spring for heavier loads (full stroke of the shock will be at the higher spring rate) and there is no preload adjuster.
An aftermarket shock (Ohlins or Penske) will have separate adjusters for the compression and rebound damping, poossibly even 4 adjuster for fast and slow / compression and rebound, depending on which model you get. THey all have at least a mechanical preload adjustment, some have a remote preload adjustment. No question that the aftermarket shock is a better shock.
The Gen 3 shocks up to 2015 will fit any model year prior. Nobody has confirmed that the 2016 shock will or will not fit too, but most likely it will since they really did not do anything with the A model swingarm or suspension linkages between 2015 and 2016.
I don't know if it fit, but I know that an ohlin's from a GEN 3 fit on a 2016 A without any issue.
Make 2 week ago on one of the last FJR 2016 A sold in france for this year
RaYzerman19
Go Wings!
I don't see why it wouldn't fit, and I suspect they've been playing with the spring rate again..... if someone has a 2016A FSM, there should be info on that.
Mad German
Well-known member
Has anyone tried a 2016 shock on their non-2016 FJR? Can anyone confirm if the spring rate on the 2016 shock is the same as the 2013-2015 shock? I' curious since I want to slap an Gen III shock on my 08, but am wondering if I should get a 2013-2015 or a 2016. What exactly are the differences between those two items?
That's an interesting question...I'm curious to know as well. I have a brand new 2013-2015 shock on the shelf waiting to be installed shortly. I bought it from PartShark a few months ago for about $430. I see that the 2016 shock is only $361! Why is it so much cheaper? I'll certainly install the one I have on the shelf, but when that one wears out...I like the price of the '16 part much better.
RaYzerman19
Go Wings!
You won't know until someone has a 2016 FSM..... we can only speculate why cheaper...... I'll just take a wild guess they lowered the spring rate a bit.....
LCB
Well-known member
I (meaning FYB/Intech) just put a '16 on my '07 and it feels OK to me. I don't know anything about spring rates, etc - I just needed a new shock and the '16 was cheaper.
ajpagosa
Well-known member
I just did this mod on my 07 w/ 20k miles, replaced the original shock with a near-new 2014 shock off of eBay ($160 shipped). Some notes after a 30 miles or so test loop on some very familiar roads.
Ride and handling: Wow! Old shock/spring clearly much softer, even set on "hard". New spring is both stiffer and rides a bit higher set on soft than the old one on hard, at least 1/2". EG putting the bike up on the center stand is easier. While riding this has the effect of putting more weight on the front tire and firmer ride in back (higher nat freq). I set the shock same as old one so did not mess with that. Really wakes up the bike and it feels much more nimble and planted, sharper steering. There is a ledge on my garage floor that I pop up over when riding the bike back in the garage, if I am not careful bike used to squat/wallow and scrape the header coming over it, esp if I am seated. On purpose with the new shock coming back in I ran right over it seated didn't even feel it. I also wonder if too soft + too low rear susp. was causing front tire wear problems and general weirdness, feels totally different now. Great mod.
Install: This wasn't too hard, I did most of it between the end of the Monaco GP and start of Indy 500 with room to spare. So maybe 2 hrs total, all done except final TQ and body panels etc. left for after the race. A few things to add to the general info.
Unbolt the adjuster lever and let it hang off (3 nuts). Then you can unbolt the little electrical box and half-cover under there (two nuts same size as prior 3), slip it off and out of the way on the left side. No need to disconnect anything, box comes right out and can hang there still connected. So there's nothing under there now except the wires attached to the adjuster lever assembly. Then remove the 4 torx head screws holding the plate (2 each side) that the ABS pump and assembly sits on. This gives you some more room over on the right side to get to the top shock bolt. I used two 17mm sockets one on each side with 6" extensions to get it loose, they slip right in on the left side and by moving around the ABS pump a bit on the right. After that nut is off on the left, just pushed the bolt all the way out using a screwdriver with the socket and extension still on the bolt head. Came right out the side with a bit of finagling.
Installing the new shock: messed with this a bit but then realized the long bolt from the lower dogbone is the same diameter as the top shock bolt. So making sure you keep the little sleeve in place on the right side, hold the shock in place and slip the dogbone bolt in from the left side, bout halfway through. This holds the shock in place (from the left), then go over to the right side and put the top shock bolt into the 17mm socket + extension. The shock/frame holes are already lined up due to the other bolt on the other side. Top shock bolt then slips right in, and pressing it all the way pops the dogbone bolt out the other side. Stick the nut on, done.
Anyway great mod, thanks to all who figured this out. I feel like I got 90% of the improvement of a Penske or similar for quite a lot less $.
Ride and handling: Wow! Old shock/spring clearly much softer, even set on "hard". New spring is both stiffer and rides a bit higher set on soft than the old one on hard, at least 1/2". EG putting the bike up on the center stand is easier. While riding this has the effect of putting more weight on the front tire and firmer ride in back (higher nat freq). I set the shock same as old one so did not mess with that. Really wakes up the bike and it feels much more nimble and planted, sharper steering. There is a ledge on my garage floor that I pop up over when riding the bike back in the garage, if I am not careful bike used to squat/wallow and scrape the header coming over it, esp if I am seated. On purpose with the new shock coming back in I ran right over it seated didn't even feel it. I also wonder if too soft + too low rear susp. was causing front tire wear problems and general weirdness, feels totally different now. Great mod.
Install: This wasn't too hard, I did most of it between the end of the Monaco GP and start of Indy 500 with room to spare. So maybe 2 hrs total, all done except final TQ and body panels etc. left for after the race. A few things to add to the general info.
Unbolt the adjuster lever and let it hang off (3 nuts). Then you can unbolt the little electrical box and half-cover under there (two nuts same size as prior 3), slip it off and out of the way on the left side. No need to disconnect anything, box comes right out and can hang there still connected. So there's nothing under there now except the wires attached to the adjuster lever assembly. Then remove the 4 torx head screws holding the plate (2 each side) that the ABS pump and assembly sits on. This gives you some more room over on the right side to get to the top shock bolt. I used two 17mm sockets one on each side with 6" extensions to get it loose, they slip right in on the left side and by moving around the ABS pump a bit on the right. After that nut is off on the left, just pushed the bolt all the way out using a screwdriver with the socket and extension still on the bolt head. Came right out the side with a bit of finagling.
Installing the new shock: messed with this a bit but then realized the long bolt from the lower dogbone is the same diameter as the top shock bolt. So making sure you keep the little sleeve in place on the right side, hold the shock in place and slip the dogbone bolt in from the left side, bout halfway through. This holds the shock in place (from the left), then go over to the right side and put the top shock bolt into the 17mm socket + extension. The shock/frame holes are already lined up due to the other bolt on the other side. Top shock bolt then slips right in, and pressing it all the way pops the dogbone bolt out the other side. Stick the nut on, done.
Anyway great mod, thanks to all who figured this out. I feel like I got 90% of the improvement of a Penske or similar for quite a lot less $.
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MCRIDER007
Well-known member
I just rode a 2016A and the shock "soft" spring rate felt much softer than my 13A. The "hard" setting on the 2016 was a noticeable improvement both in ride quality and handling for my 220 lb body but I suspect it would be be undersprung for me if I were riding 2-up.
I should add that the first time I rode a 13A demo I felt the spring rates in both positions were too soft, 5 months later I rode a second 13A demo and the shock felt totally different and very smooth......I bought that demo and still have it so maybe all GEN3 shocks are not the same.
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Mad German
Well-known member
Digging up an old thread. I have a line on a 2016 OEM shock, but before I take the plunge, I'm curious to see if anyone can confirm or deny that the 2016 shock spring(s) is softer than the 2013-2015 OEM shock spring(s). From reading this thread, it seems as if Yamaha softened the spring rates a bit on the 2016, possibly reflected in the lower price for the 2016 shock vs. a 2013-2015.
Any insights would be appreciated. I don't want to purchase it if it's not an improvement over my current Gen II (with 13,000 miles on it) shock.
Thanks guys.
Any insights would be appreciated. I don't want to purchase it if it's not an improvement over my current Gen II (with 13,000 miles on it) shock.
Thanks guys.
Mad German
Well-known member
Anyone...?
08FJR4ME
-WYNPRO-
Maybe a different thread but I believe the 2016 spring is different. Going by memory.
Dave
Dave
The problem is that even if we knew what the 2016 spring rates were, the published spring rates for the 2013 - 2015 are jacked up.
In the FSM it claims that the two Soft spring rates are:
K1 = 00-42mm stroke 976.41 lb/in
K2 = 42-60mm stroke 1952.83 lb/in.
... and the Hard spring rate is:
K1 = 14.1-60mm stroke 976.41 lb/in
Which makes no sense. In all prior years the Soft K2 spring rate was that same as the Hard K1 spring rate with the shorter spring coil locked out.
I would guess that what they meant was that the longer spring is 976.41, and that the shorter spring is 1952.83 by itself, which would mean the effective spring rate together would produce:
651 lb.f/in for the K1 stroke of 42mm. Then after the shorter coil gets bound the rate goes up to 976 lb.f/in for the remainder of the stroke (K2).
2nd Gens had shock springs that had published effective spring rates of 520 lb/in for the first 42mm and 708 lb/in for the remainder, and 708 for the full stroke in Hard.
'04 and '05 1st Gens had 475 lb/in soft rate but only for 32mm then 672 lb/in for the remainder, and 672 for all of Hard, but also had a shorter swing arm than later Gens have.
And early 1st Gens ('03 and earlier) had 409 lb/in and 582 lb/in. effective rates.
Does anyone have the published spring rates for the '16A?
In the FSM it claims that the two Soft spring rates are:
K1 = 00-42mm stroke 976.41 lb/in
K2 = 42-60mm stroke 1952.83 lb/in.
... and the Hard spring rate is:
K1 = 14.1-60mm stroke 976.41 lb/in
Which makes no sense. In all prior years the Soft K2 spring rate was that same as the Hard K1 spring rate with the shorter spring coil locked out.
I would guess that what they meant was that the longer spring is 976.41, and that the shorter spring is 1952.83 by itself, which would mean the effective spring rate together would produce:
651 lb.f/in for the K1 stroke of 42mm. Then after the shorter coil gets bound the rate goes up to 976 lb.f/in for the remainder of the stroke (K2).
2nd Gens had shock springs that had published effective spring rates of 520 lb/in for the first 42mm and 708 lb/in for the remainder, and 708 for the full stroke in Hard.
'04 and '05 1st Gens had 475 lb/in soft rate but only for 32mm then 672 lb/in for the remainder, and 672 for all of Hard, but also had a shorter swing arm than later Gens have.
And early 1st Gens ('03 and earlier) had 409 lb/in and 582 lb/in. effective rates.
Does anyone have the published spring rates for the '16A?
ajpagosa
Well-known member
The 2016 base (non-ES) OEM rear shock is now a KYB unit. So it is definitely not the same as 2013-15, whether it has a stiffer/softer spring(s) or not have no idea. I have read that the 2016 ES spring rate is same as gen 2 (676 lb/in) so softer than 13-15 (over 900). But you get true preload adjust on the ES, not just hard/soft.
edit: Fred's post is better
edit: Fred's post is better
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The ES shock spring rate is 685 lb/in single rate for the full 63mm stroke.
So the 2013-2015A would be nearly the same in soft, but much stiffer / harder in the hard position.
Regardless of the shock body it's mounted on, if we can get the spring rates and strokes they will still compare directly.
So the 2013-2015A would be nearly the same in soft, but much stiffer / harder in the hard position.
Regardless of the shock body it's mounted on, if we can get the spring rates and strokes they will still compare directly.
ajpagosa
Well-known member
OK good. So this means what I read was wrong, 2016 ES single spring is still approx as stiff as gen 2 was in hard mode, and stiffer than the first 42 mm in soft mode.
Subjectively the gen 3 in soft mode feels stiffer than the gen 2 in hard mode, but that may be due to other dfferences.
Subjectively the gen 3 in soft mode feels stiffer than the gen 2 in hard mode, but that may be due to other dfferences.
MCRIDER007
Well-known member
I have only ridden a 16A one time and it certainly appeared the spring rate in the Soft position was significantly lower than my 13A in the Soft position. The Hard spring rate seemed to be comparable.
The Soft position uses 2 springs in series and the upper spring, by itself, has a spring rate in the 1800-2000 lb range. As such, the upper spring is never going get coil bound before the lower spring....and I can't see how the lower spring could coil bind in the first 42mm of stroke or it would also coil bind when the shock is in the Hard position. As such, I think the FSM isn't accurate and the Soft position actually has a uniform spring rate throughout its total stroke.
The ES spring rate cannot be directly compared to the A spring rates because the rear suspensions use different parts resulting in different linkage ratios.
The Soft position uses 2 springs in series and the upper spring, by itself, has a spring rate in the 1800-2000 lb range. As such, the upper spring is never going get coil bound before the lower spring....and I can't see how the lower spring could coil bind in the first 42mm of stroke or it would also coil bind when the shock is in the Hard position. As such, I think the FSM isn't accurate and the Soft position actually has a uniform spring rate throughout its total stroke.
The ES spring rate cannot be directly compared to the A spring rates because the rear suspensions use different parts resulting in different linkage ratios.
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Spud
Well-known member
I put a Gen III shock on my '08 and I like the way it feels. My take-off was totally shot with 70K or something so no surprise it was a lot better, but it does have a nice ride and seems to be similar to how the bike felt when it was new.
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