AE Clutch Engagement is Adjustable

[Lerdog]

06FJRPILOT Thanks for the detailed response to the "Code" question

 

[pilotonboard]

OK, here is what I am starting to find out-even though the owner's manual says to roll off the throttle between shifts I find that the shifting is silky-smooth (no clunking) if you just unload the throttle by a nearly imperceptible amount between shifts. Going all the way to full stop on the throttle for each shift causes a dramatic jerking and seems unnecessary. I think it is logical to say that if shifting without rolling off the throttle all the way was to damage the bike the transmission would be screaming at you all the time to stop doing this. A nearly silent "click" and smooth transition to the next gear is what I am getting with this technique and I am going to continue to use it for now. I have put 3500 miles on in six weeks and I am really starting to like this bike.

OK, here is what I am starting to find out-even though the owner's manual says to roll off the throttle between shifts I find that the shifting is silky-smooth (no clunking) if you just unload the throttle by a nearly imperceptible amount between shifts. Going all the way to full stop on the throttle for each shift causes a dramatic jerking and seems unnecessary. I think it is logical to say that if shifting without rolling off the throttle all the way was to damage the bike the transmission would be screaming at you all the time to stop doing this. A nearly silent "click" and smooth transition to the next gear is what I am getting with this technique and I am going to continue to use it for now. I have put 3500 miles on in six weeks and I am really starting to like this bike.

 

[Cdogman]

"Broke the shifting code at 800 miles ..."

06FJRPILOT - What do you mean when you say that you broke the shift code?

As I mentioned, the bike sifted pretty smoothly from day one. However, by about the 800 mile mark I had developed shifting techniques that made all shifts up and down seamless and extremely smooth. I have found it takes " extremely" minor rapid throttle movement dependent on how much the bike is pulling or decelerating at the time of shift. Different throttle technique for decelerations. Also different throttle technique for the run of the mill shifts when not pulling or decelerating hard.

This bike shines due to the ability to shift quickly and smoothly while in the twisties while having both feet firmly planted on the foot pets. Throttle technique for the shifting condition is the key to smooth shifts on the "AE".

Smooth throttle operation and how you handle the slack throttle between 1100 rpm and 2000 rpm will eliminate all the jerky stuff folks talk about experiencing. Bring the throttle up smoothly and slowly to eleminate the dead area. Then when your ready to go, its just a matter of rolling the throttle on. In the interest of clutch wear, timing when to be in gear and when to take up slack is important. If I don't have a precieved threat from the rear while at a red light I shift into neutral and stay there until the light is about to turn green. A second or two before the light changes I select first gear and begin to eleminate that dead rpm space. When the light changes I just continue to roll on the throttle. Makes for a smooth and efficent starts with hopefully minimal wear on the clutch.

When accelerating and pulling hard lead selecting the shift by an almost unnoticable (what I mean about unnoticable is less than a quarter inch of movement in the wrist) "rapid" throttle wrist movement in the direction of rolling the throttle off. Shift, then immediately move your rist back to the original throttle position. The whole process of throttle wrist movement and the shift is instantainious. The wrist throttle movement is about the same as if you make a fist and and just squeeze your fingers. That is about the amount of movement of the throttle in both directions with the sift coming at the roll off point. It is difficult to explain because the wrist movement is so small and so quick with the sift selected just prior to returning the wrist to the original throttle position. Just takes practice, thus the 800 miles. This technique is for fast acceleration.

Try it some and if it works for you we can talk down shifts and those routine shifts when your not pulling much or decelerating.

I think I have 5300 miles on the "AE" as of today and I love it more and more each day! I am now waiting for the clutch to explode or the impending clutch recall I read about on forum the other day to come about. Both of which I doubt will come true. Side note: I had a Kawasaki Vulcan 2000 that developed a problem and when the dealership made the repair I was told that the factory used an incorrect torque value and that all the 2004 Vulcan 2000's would be recalled. Took a year and a half for that recall to materalize. Seems a bit early to see a recall on the "AE". I guess anything is possible, however I am not going to get excited about the possibility. Think I will ride it instead.

I hope my rambling helps. All good things come in time!

+1

I called it (a few weeks ago in a post I made) I twitch my wrist in a roll off but just a twitch. My AE shifts smooth like a hot knife through butter. It is proper technique. Under hard access it is critical that the twitch is precise and practiced. The harder and accelleration, the more twitch, but faster back to the original state prior to the shift. Makes the AE seamless and the bike never noses over on the throttle hard once mastered

I call tell when I botch it (still practising the proper twitch) I can also tell when I nail it. Like swinging a 3 wood at a topflight and hearing the faintest [SIZE=8pt]"tink"[/SIZE] You know that ball is long and straight, no need to look

 

[bikerkash]

I now have 14k on my AE and agree with most of what is posted about smooth shifting. Another thing that I've learned is the earlier you make your shifts to 2nd & 3rd the smoother you will be, however if you make the shift to 2nd too soon the clutch will slip badly. Once you learn the sweet spot you can make very smooth shifts in the lower gears. RIDE SAFE

 

[ROBSMST]

Just in case anyone is wondering...

I did the Barberian and adjusted my CO.

I followed the instructions on here and I could not get into the YCCS diagnostic mode.

Perhaps you need some thing else plugged in.

 

[mcatrophy]

...Perhaps you need some thing else plugged in.

Yes, there's a link required to a connector somewhere behind the left facia panel. I'm sure someone more knowledgable than me can quote chapter and verse (I don't have a workshop manual).

 

[Ford68xl]

I have 400 miles on my AE and have just about figured out how to be smooth all of the time. I do experience the "cold clutch" stuttering but I find if I apply a little resistance with my feet as the clutch is engaging the stutter goes away. After it's warmed up the AE engages as smoothly as any conventionally clutched bike I have owned. With the exception of the fully automatic V8 bike I had, this bike is the most enjoyable bike to ride as far as transmission is concerned. Other manufactures should explore this technology instead of trying to build an automatic tranny.

 

[ROBSMST]

I've got the smooth throttle thing down. I just think that that once warmed up, with all the torque this bike has it would be nice for it to kick in just a tad earlier.

I saw the connector when i did the barbarian mod. There is one connector next to the ECU that is white but has a black cover and isn't connected to anything.b

 

[mcatrophy]

...I saw the connector when i did the barbarian mod. There is one connector next to the ECU that is white but has a black cover and isn't connected to anything.b

It's not by the ECU, it's somewhere in front of the glove-box.

 

[phil]

Having a drag-race mentality, I typically shift gears without relenting on the throttle, only because I know I can get away with it on the AE. This causes a "double-clutch" feel to the shifts. Today, I tried dumping the throttle just before I geared up (old-style), and this seems to smooth the changes. It also allows the engine to grab more power for acceleration on the return to higher rpm in the next gear, kinda like getting a fresh gulp of air.

I know what you guys are talking about when you say it takes getting used-to. I've ridden moto, enduro, and street. Every bike has its idiosyncracies, but the auto-clutch is especially unique. The idea of clutch engagement at lower rpms is most interesting in coming off the line in 1st gear, as I have noticed the vehicle's reluctance to launch on an uphill start, or starting from grassy areas. I certainly will keep a close eye on this thread! Thanks. Phil

 

[Rondo777]

I've got 2k miles on my AE and have also found that the shifting is silky smooth with just the right quick flick of the throttle. I also have noticed that when using this method of shifting, if your too aggrssive on the throttle after hittling the shift button that the clutch seems to slip quite a bit. Its only noticable shifting into 2nd and 3rd gears. Any body else see this happen?

 

[krouske]

06FJRAEPILOT has explained the operation on the AE perfectly. I continue to enjoy the AE and incredible innovation that made this happen.

I have slipped the clutch when shifting down during hard acceleration 4th to 3rd but it was my fault not dropping the throttle enough for a fast engagement. When starting in first you have to be easy on the throttle. The clutch has a waited engagement point that causes it to engage at around 1300 RPM. If you roll your throttle fast it will engage fast. It all depends on your throttle response.

I have no reason why I would not want the AE and continue to enjoy the seamless shifting.

 

[dhillis]

I'll have to agree with everyone else on the quick twitch throttle release between shifts... very smooth. However, and I know this is extremely subjective, but the throttle on this bike is way too stiff for smooth throttle operation.

I performed the throttle return spring mod and that definitely helped. But what I found to be the key adjustment, after performing the return spring mod, is adjusting the slack in the throttle cable. It is very important to do this while you have the tank up, so you can watch the throttle cable and spring at the same time. You will notice how much slack is in the throttle cable and when you operate the throttle, there is an inch or so of throttle twist before you can watch the cable tighten up on the return spring coil.

I read another thread where a fellow member may have had his throttle stick, or atleast not return like normal. After manipulating the throttle and messing with the cable adjustment, there is a fine line between too little and too much throttle slack. I was able to repeat the conditions that the member spoke of about the throttle sticking. It doesn't actually stick, but it definitely hangs for a moment, which would be multiplied when heading into a corner at speed. Backing the slack off just a hair makes the throttle snap back just like before the return spring mod. If you go too far and there is too much slack, then you don't have good throttle reponse, and too little slack is too little throttle return.

I know it's five more minutes of work to take the tank off so you can see the throttle return coil, but I would highly suggest anyone do it this way, whether they did the return spring mod or not. It allows for a very tight tolerance and gives you ultimate throttle performance. I can do a "how to" and possible video and link it to my website "www.hillisfabrication.com" for everyone to use.

Getting to the point about the YCCS, I am going to knock down the clutch engagement to approximatley 1300 or 1250 and see how that goes. I don't believe it will affect high idle operation, as tested the high idle clutch engagement and found that the computer compensates for the high idle and activates clutch engagement at a higher RPM than high idle. My only concern is the potential for lack of power and slipping the clutch. I will test it and let everyone know how it peforms.

Take care,

Dan

 

[Beamer Reamer]

I have the AE as well and love it, now that I have made a few adjustments. The first day I rode it, it was very, very hard to be smooth. I almost immediately backed off the throttle spring one revolution which made a world of difference. The next thing I did was add grip puppies which not only made the grip larger (duh) but made it "stickier". This makes it a lot easier to smoothly work the throttle since you aren't squeezing hard any longer. Last, I installed the PC3 and used the Wally Smoothness map for the lower RPM's - 2500 and down. With these three mods, the bike is super smooth.

This past couple of days I operated it in downtown Portland, through tight parking garages, low speed tight turns, and stop and go traffic - all with a passenger. It handled awesome.

As mentioned earlier, working the throttle at higher RPM shifts is the name of the game. You can hear when you miss...

 

[Scotty]

This maybe off the thread but at what RPM do you shift to get max performance on the AE - 100 rpm before cut off, max hp rpm, max torque rpm, etc?

 

[IronHorse]

Hey guys,

have any of you done the clutch soak yet? My was jerky on take offs clunky loud shifts. Everything your all describing I have an 07AE

and i did the clutch soak and damn that thing is smooth as silk. It shifts so quietly I love it. But I agree with all of you, my initial impression

was clunky, jerky, loud and I think I may have a made a mistake! Trust me, Clutch Plate Soak!

Do a search there are numerous posts on the procedure. I did not do mine I took it in and Yamaha covered it. Not much labor really and only 1 gasket.

Anyone that likes to wrench can do this fairly easily. There are detailed instructions with pics on the forum.

Smooth As Silk!

 

[IronHorse]

I've got 2k miles on my AE and have also found that the shifting is silky smooth with just the right quick flick of the throttle. I also have noticed that when using this method of shifting, if your too aggrssive on the throttle after hittling the shift button that the clutch seems to slip quite a bit. Its only noticable shifting into 2nd and 3rd gears. Any body else see this happen?

Hey Rondo,

Mine does the same thing, I think it must be some kind of safety when you shift to quick to protect the trans but I really don't like it.

The only time it does it is when I really want or need the power and it has like a 1 second lag before full engagement thus full power.

I sure would like to disable that feature! Anyone else have any info on why the AE does that?

 

[EDubya]

This maybe off the thread but at what RPM do you shift to get max performance on the AE - 100 rpm before cut off, max hp rpm, max torque rpm, etc?

I run it up near redline and pull the trigger while leaving the throttle WFO. Good stuff.

 

[RadioHowie]

I sure would like to disable that feature!

Trade in on an A?

 

[DaSpyda]

Are you guys using this?

Personally, I find moving it into the higher RPMs before shifting greatly increases the smooth shifts; the throttle flick is quite effective.