Need assistance with suspension settings

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froggy123

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Just got back from my first extended ride on my 2012 FJR, 12 days 4,400+ miles. While I had no technical issues, I couldn't help but notice how "heavy" the bike felt in the turns. At 5,700 miles on the bike, the original BT021's cupped so bad I had to have them replaced mid trip with Michelin Pilot Road 2's. What a difference!!!!!! the bike felt 200lbs lighter. Now I'd like to work on the suspension. I'm 5' 8" tall and weigh 170 lbs. I'm not a real aggressive rider but I do like to pick up the pace in the twisties. Any advise?

 
Just got back from my first extended ride on my 2012 FJR, 12 days 4,400+ miles. While I had no technical issues, I couldn't help but notice how "heavy" the bike felt in the turns. At 5,700 miles on the bike, the original BT021's cupped so bad I had to have them replaced mid trip with Michelin Pilot Road 2's. What a difference!!!!!! the bike felt 200lbs lighter. Now I'd like to work on the suspension. I'm 5' 8" tall and weigh 170 lbs. I'm not a real aggressive rider but I do like to pick up the pace in the twisties. Any advise?
Start with a new front fork rebuild. GP suspension (KFG Racing) and Race Tech make excellent kits for the FJR. Then a new rear shock, Penske or Ohlins are very popular and work fantastic. I did the GP Suspension and Penske shock from KFG and it is truly amazing. Best upgrade you can do is the suspension. Do a forum search on suspension and you'll find many, many testimonials. Look in the Vendor area, group buys and you'll find the deals to purchase the products or since you live in Cali, you probably have a nearby suspension specialist that can improve your ride.

 
Well stated, I agree with Gary, I have the same setup, a little bit of money invested, but worth it :)

 
Also check out the Bin of Facts for the Gen II. There's some recommended front and rear suspension settings in there. Try them.

When my Gen II had about 24k miles on it I serviced the fork tubes replacing the bushings, seals, and re-filled them with Motul Light 5wt Fork Oil. The difference was immediately apparent, and in a good way!! The fork was "tighter", and the bike just performed much better in the twisties.

If you're mechanically inclined, the procedure to service the fork tubes can be found in several excellent threads on this forum.

You might try the above ideas before you invest in a new suspension.

Might work for you.

 
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Give Froggy a break! He hasn't even got the bike broken in yet. Froggy, since you say you're not very aggressive and at 170# you're lighter than a lot of us you can work with the stock suspension. It won't be great but it'll do. Here's the classic HaulinAshe post for suspension adjustment that covers gen 1 and gen 2 bikes - Link. That'll get you started as good as any.

The basic problem with the stock suspension is that it's apparently designed for 150# Japanese riders. If at some point in the future you find yourself often scraping the peg feelers in curves then it's time to start looking in to after market suspension. You will have maxed out the stock set up and there's nothing else to be done for it.

 
Give Froggy a break! He hasn't even got the bike broken in yet. Froggy, since you say you're not very aggressive and at 170# you're lighter than a lot of us you can work with the stock suspension. It won't be great but it'll do. Here's the classic HaulinAshe post for suspension adjustment that covers gen 1 and gen 2 bikes - Link. That'll get you started as good as any.
The basic problem with the stock suspension is that it's apparently designed for 150# Japanese riders. If at some point in the future you find yourself often scraping the peg feelers in curves then it's time to start looking in to after market suspension. You will have maxed out the stock set up and there's nothing else to be done for it.
+1, That's basically what I was sayin'. Try the revised settings via "Bin o Facts", which should help a lot. If that doesn't work have the fork tubes serviced, and if that doesn't work go to what others have posted above.

leedavis, IMO you are giving excellent advice!!

 
Unlike on cars, suspension (and its adjustments) doesn't really cause tires to cup. Tires cup due to (low) pressure and loads. So, don't worry too much about that "feature", just don't buy those tires again if the cupping bothers you. Most people find the Bridgestones cup on the front.

I'm assuming that your initial question was regarding what can be done to the stock suspension to make it better, rather than what aftermarket replacements can be bought. Running with that, the adjustments that you have available to you are somewhat limited.

You should start out by trying to get the sags as close as possible and then dial in the damping as good as you can get. Here's a thumbnail sketch on what you want to do:

Front Sag: Put a Tie wrap around one of your inner fork legs. Sit on the bike (feet up if possible) and have an assistant push the tie wrap down so it contacts the lower fork leg slider (dust seal on top). Get off the bike carefully and put the bike up on the center stand without disturbing the tie wrap. Measure the distance from the bottom of the tie wrap and the top of the dust seal and that is your sag. You want it to be between 35 and 45mm for street use. You can make some adjustment with the preload adjuster on the top of the fork caps. Smaller sag will feel firmer.

Rear Sag. Same drill but you need to make weighted and unweighted measurements from the (moving) frame to the (stationary) swing arm or axle. You only have "soft" and "hard" so pick the one that gives you the most appropriate sag. It will probably be "hard."

Once you have your sags as good as you can get them you'll adjust the damping. Starts out with all the damper adjusters dialed all the way out. Set rebound (front and rear) first.

Front Rebound: Sitting on the bike roll it forward. Quickly stab at the front brake to make the fork compress and immediately release it. Watch and feel how the fork responds. You want it to quickly recover to the resting height and not overshoot it. If it overshoots and bounces (it should with no rebound dialed in) add rebound damping a few clicks at a time. Rebound will be on adjuster the top of the fork. Only add enough sop that the fork doesn't bounce. More than that will not help.

Rear rebound: Put the bike on the side stand and stand on the right side (away from the kickstand). With your foot push down on the right side foot peg which will compress the rear shock, and then release it. Watch the rear end for the same overshoot at the top (it should do that with the adjuster all the way open). Add rebound until it just returns to the resting height with no overshoot.

Compression damping on the fork is trickier. You have to ride the bike and "feel" it to adjust. Starting at zero, incrementally increase the damping until the front end of the bike begins to feel "harsh", or too stiff, over bumps. At that point back off the adjusters two or three clicks and that is the best you can do. This should give you the greatest amount of low speed compression damping that you can use. The adjusters (supposedly) only really adjust the slow speed compression circuit as the high speed is controlled by the shims stack in the valve at the bottom of the cartridge. But too much low speed causes the forks to feel rigid on high speed transitions too.

You can influence both high and low speed damping by putting different fork oil in there, but you need to know what your goal is before doing it or you'll go broke buying and changing fork oils.

The stock back shock has no adjustment for compression damping.

These steps should get you very close to the best you can get and then you can make small (1 click) changes from there based on what feels best on the road. To make the suspension any better than this requires re=springing and re-valving at the front, and an aftermarket, more capable shock in the rear.

Good luck, and let us know how you make out.

 
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Unlike on cars, suspension (and its adjustments) doesn't really cause tires to cup. Tires cup due to (low) pressure and loads. So, don't worry too much about that "feature", just don't buy those tires again if the cupping bothers you. Most people find the Bridgestones cup on the front.
I'm assuming that your initial question was regarding what can be done to the stock suspension to make it better, rather than what aftermarket replacements can be bought. Running with that, the adjustments that you have available to you are somewhat limited.

You should start out by trying to get the sags as close as possible and then dial in the damping as good as you can get. Here's a thumbnail sketch on what you want to do:

Front Sag: Put a Tie wrap around one of your inner fork legs. Sit on the bike (feet up if possible) and have an assistant push the tie wrap down so it contacts the lower fork leg slider (dust seal on top). Get off the bike carefully and put the bike up on the center stand without disturbing the tie wrap. Measure the distance from the bottom of the tie wrap and the top of the dust seal and that is your sag. You want it to be between 35 and 45mm for street use. You can make some adjustment with the preload adjuster on the top of the fork caps. Smaller sag will feel firmer.

Rear Sag. Same drill but you need to make weighted and unweighted measurements from the (moving) frame to the (stationary) swing arm or axle. You only have "soft" and "hard" so pick the one that gives you the most appropriate sag. It will probably be "hard."

Once you have your sags as good as you can get them you'll adjust the damping. Starts out with all the damper adjusters dialed all the way out. Set rebound (front and rear) first.

Front Rebound: Sitting on the bike roll it forward. Quickly stab at the front brake to make the fork compress and immediately release it. Watch and feel how the fork responds. You want it to quickly recover to the resting height and not overshoot it. If it overshoots and bounces (it should with no rebound dialed in) add rebound damping a few clicks at a time. Rebound will be on adjuster the top of the fork. Only add enough sop that the fork doesn't bounce. More than that will not help.

Rear rebound: Put the bike on the side stand and stand on the right side (away from the kickstand). With your foot push down on the right side foot peg which will compress the rear shock, and then release it. Watch the rear end for the same overshoot at the top (it should do that with the adjuster all the way open). Add rebound until it just returns to the resting height with no overshoot.

Compression damping on the fork is trickier. You have to ride the bike and "feel" it to adjust. Starting at zero, incrementally increase the damping until the front end of the bike begins to feel "harsh", or too stiff, over bumps. At that point back off the adjusters two or three clicks and that is the best you can do. This should give you the greatest amount of low speed compression damping that you can use. The adjusters (supposedly) only really adjust the slow speed compression circuit as the high speed is controlled by the shims stack in the valve at the bottom of the cartridge. But too much low speed causes the forks to feel rigid on high speed transitions too.

You can influence both high and low speed damping by putting different fork oil in there, but you need to know what your goal is before doing it or you'll go broke buying and changing fork oils.

The stock back shock has no adjustment for compression damping.

These steps should get you very close to the best you can get and then you can make small (1 click) changes from there based on what feels best on the road. To make the suspension any better than this requires re=springing and re-valving at the front, and an aftermarket, more capable shock in the rear.

Good luck, and let us know how you make out.

+100

 
WOW, thatks for all or the advise. I'll start with the adjustments on the stock suspension and see how it goes from there(FA, thanks for the detialed instructions). It's good to know there is a ton of aftermarket equipment if needed.

Love the year round riding weather in San Jose California....

 
Froggy,

If you're in San Jose, you should check out Doc Wong's riding clinics. He has one specifically on suspension. Two, actually, since it's broken up into 2 parts. His classes are totally free, and you can sign up to be notified via email about upcoming classes. No spam, no nothing, just emails about classes.

https://www.docwong.com/st-clinc/

Looks like he has a Suspension-1 class coming up on September 13.

I recommend any of their classes to anyone that wants to make the ride to just south of San Francisco.

I went a few years ago when they were taught by Gary Jaehne. Unfortunately Gary passed away in a motorcycle accident a little over a year ago. Knowing Doc, though, he's found someone almost as good to teach the class.

 
I hope this inst considered hijacking...

2 days ago I made the adjustments suggested by HaulinAsh.

Front 3-8-8

Rear 8 - Soft

The difference was HUGE!

However, many people have commented on how "on rails" the FJR has felt to them when the suspension was set to this.

I'm 200# at 5'7" without any gear, and when taking the turns, the bike is much lighter, which is good, BUT it doesn't seem to track well.

I am not sure if my skills are just not there yet, or if the tires are worn, but I feel like any small movement in my body will make the bike change. Is that how it's supposed to be?

The bike felt really heavy before the adjustments, and in turns, it felt like I could wiggle all day long and it would maintain the line. Now, I have to be very still...

 
Setting your suspension based on someone else's recommended number of clicks is not a very accurate technique. There is way too much variability between bikes for that to work repeatably with any degree of accuracy.

Read my post #8 above. Learn to adjust your own suspension by observation and feel and stop counting clicks.

 
I hope this inst considered hijacking...
2 days ago I made the adjustments suggested by HaulinAsh.

Front 3-8-8

Rear 8 - Soft

The difference was HUGE!

However, many people have commented on how "on rails" the FJR has felt to them when the suspension was set to this.

I'm 200# at 5'7" without any gear, and when taking the turns, the bike is much lighter, which is good, BUT it doesn't seem to track well.

I am not sure if my skills are just not there yet, or if the tires are worn, but I feel like any small movement in my body will make the bike change. Is that how it's supposed to be?

The bike felt really heavy before the adjustments, and in turns, it felt like I could wiggle all day long and it would maintain the line. Now, I have to be very still...
Try backing off the rear by two clicks, maybe three, that is 10 to 11 clicks out. See if that helps. Temperature can affect the settings too. Tighten up in hot weather, loosen up in cold weather. I find weather adjustments can be dialed in, in plus or minus two clicks. I keep my front the same all the time.

Fresh tires really help as well. Once the sides of dual compound tires wear out, the handling suffers noticeably. Heavy steering can also be the result of low tire pressures.

 
I hope this inst considered hijacking...
2 days ago I made the adjustments suggested by HaulinAsh.

Front 3-8-8

Rear 8 - Soft

The difference was HUGE!

However, many people have commented on how "on rails" the FJR has felt to them when the suspension was set to this.

I'm 200# at 5'7" without any gear, and when taking the turns, the bike is much lighter, which is good, BUT it doesn't seem to track well.

I am not sure if my skills are just not there yet, or if the tires are worn, but I feel like any small movement in my body will make the bike change. Is that how it's supposed to be?

The bike felt really heavy before the adjustments, and in turns, it felt like I could wiggle all day long and it would maintain the line. Now, I have to be very still...
It sounds like what you are describing is too quick of steering. If so the solution, if you are on the shock's soft setting, is to raise the ride height on the front end by turning the ride height/preload adjuster clockwise so you have less lines showing. This increases the "trail" and will make the bike less sensitive to steering inputs and body changes.
 
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Things that I did not post, that I should have...

My rear tire is the original POS Bridgestones with 11K on it with 42PSI. Plenty of sidewall, but probably 1K left of tread. The front is PR2 with 3K miles with 42PSI. Yep, both have the scallop thing going.

After further testing, I'm was thinking of backing off a bit in the settings. However, this morning's ride has made me think twice. I'm getting used to the precision carving, and will keep this for a few more days.

As John D suggested, I will back off to compare, and MCRIDE's suggestion will be done subsequently.

Thanks to all for the great assistance!

 
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