Short long story

[Harald]

As I understand it my time spent on 1 wheel will be greatly reduced. I don't see that as a good thing. My wife on the other hand...

I've never ridden an inferior Gen I FJR, but I suspect that the affect of the Gen II extended swingarm on wheelying is greatly exaggerated. I can tell you that if you whack the throttle open at 5k rpm in first gear on a Gen II, the front end WILL come up. :yahoo:

 

[JamesK]

I am just wondering can you think of any reason for this kind of premature failure?

GenI FJRs are subject to worn valve guides. (Tickers) I believe they can happen at any time. Though it wasn't verified, it looked like it was slowly happening to the #1 cylinder on my 226k FJR. Of course, after 226k miles, many of them pretty hard, I wasn't very upset.

What we don't know is maintenance history. I do know of an 04 FJR that's engine was pretty much dead (all cylinders) at 75k miles. Owner had never done a valve check, and the rest of the maintenance history (oil changes and whatnot) was suspect too.

Welldunn - how often did you have a valve check done? What kind of oil did you use? Regular maintenace performed?

The valve checks were done at 28k, 60k, 83k. All by the same dealer all came back no adjustment needed. I knew that was suspect and should have taken it someplace else but never got around to it.

We are 90% sure the valve burned then broke because the clearance was too tight.

The rest of the maintenance was done by myself. The only oil to run in the bike was yamalube and changed around every 3k - 4k. The head is very clean

No oil varnish, very little carbon. My new mechanic was real impressed with how clean the head looked. If the valves had been adjusted properly I believe the motor would have had many more miles. At the time of failure my oil use was near zero. If I just had to replace the valves and lap the seat I was looking at a $1500 bill. The worn valve guides and all the work needed to replace them was the deal breaker. $2500 to $3000 was the estimate. I did find a new head assembly on line for $1300.

Just a point of reference, the valves on my '07 with 108k miles have been within spec since new, i've done the valve checks myself (under supervision) so i know it was actually done/checked.

 

[Welldunn]

I am just wondering can you think of any reason for this kind of premature failure?

GenI FJRs are subject to worn valve guides. (Tickers) I believe they can happen at any time. Though it wasn't verified, it looked like it was slowly happening to the #1 cylinder on my 226k FJR. Of course, after 226k miles, many of them pretty hard, I wasn't very upset.

What we don't know is maintenance history. I do know of an 04 FJR that's engine was pretty much dead (all cylinders) at 75k miles. Owner had never done a valve check, and the rest of the maintenance history (oil changes and whatnot) was suspect too.

Welldunn - how often did you have a valve check done? What kind of oil did you use? Regular maintenace performed?

The valve checks were done at 28k, 60k, 83k. All by the same dealer all came back no adjustment needed. I knew that was suspect and should have taken it someplace else but never got around to it.

We are 90% sure the valve burned then broke because the clearance was too tight.

The rest of the maintenance was done by myself. The only oil to run in the bike was yamalube and changed around every 3k - 4k. The head is very clean

No oil varnish, very little carbon. My new mechanic was real impressed with how clean the head looked. If the valves had been adjusted properly I believe the motor would have had many more miles. At the time of failure my oil use was near zero. If I just had to replace the valves and lap the seat I was looking at a $1500 bill. The worn valve guides and all the work needed to replace them was the deal breaker. $2500 to $3000 was the estimate. I did find a new head assembly on line for $1300.

Just a point of reference, the valves on my '07 with 108k miles have been within spec since new, i've done the valve checks myself (under supervision) so i know it was actually done/checked.

Another good example of YMMV. In the case of this bike at the time of failure several of the valves were not even close to tolerance.

It looks like I have a buyer for the bike in a box. I hope everything goes as planed.

 

[Greb]

Yep, my '08 had two valves out of spec at 25K. I guess some just get lucky. I was surprised I had to adjust valves since I've always heard they stay in spec for a long time.

I hope your dealer didn't screw you over and take your money without doing the maintenance.

Can they really break from being too tight and if so how? Is this from a wearing of the valve seats or the tappet/bucket?

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

Can they really break from being too tight and if so how? Is this from a wearing of the valve seats or the tappet/bucket?

Well, we'll have to take 'Welldunn's word for it (he was there, he saw the damage and reported it) -- I guess anything's possible...?

It is, sometimes, hard to reconstruct the sequence of events (and, the original culprit) from examining the results of a disaster. Valves, nowadays, wear (if they wear at all...?) in the area of the valve face and valve seat and the (designed-in) clearance becomes less. In an extreme case: all the clearance would, eventually, go-away and the valve would be left -- open (some). For an exhaust valve, this would probably cause eroding of metal (burning) of the valve face and some eroding of the valve seat -- and the resulting loss of compression.

Valves have been known to break (historically, auto/engine-industry-wide) on very rare occasions from basic mechanical/fracture failure (bad part).

The tappet/bucket (cam follower) has, I believe, an enviable service-life -- hardened, no/negligible wear -- as with the (similarly, hardened) cam lobes .

 

[Greb]

Can they really break from being too tight and if so how? Is this from a wearing of the valve seats or the tappet/bucket?

Well, we'll have to take 'Welldunn's word for it (he was there, he saw the damage and reported it) -- I guess anything's possible...?

It is, sometimes, hard to reconstruct the sequence of events (and, the original culprit) from examining the results of a disaster. Valves, nowadays, wear (if they wear at all...?) in the area of the valve face and valve seat and the (designed-in) clearance becomes less. In an extreme case: all the clearance would, eventually, go-away and the valve would be left -- open (some). For an exhaust valve, this would probably cause eroding of metal (burning) of the valve face and some eroding of the valve seat -- and the resulting loss of compression.

Valves have been known to break (historically, auto/engine-industry-wide) on very rare occasions from basic mechanical/fracture failure (bad part).

The tappet/bucket (cam follower) has, I believe, an enviable service-life -- hardened, no/negligible wear -- as with the (similarly, hardened) cam lobes .

Thanks, that helps me picture what is going on in there a bit more. I had to put in smaller shims/valve pads by about .05 mm to get back in spec. I guess the valves seated a little bit past where it was set at the factory.

 

[DonRed7]

Ionbeam would really appreciate a rad that's not leaking,..but he's too shy to ask. You could really get on the good side of the forum gods and cut him a sweet deal.

Congrats on the new hot rod,...rather strong statement about these bike that with bunch of new stuff on the go many keep comming back to a basically 8 yr old design.

My last payment was yesterday!!!! and i think i have managed to supress the urge.. K1600gtl bug that bit a couple of mths ago. Time to save $ and tweak the current beast.

Cheers

Don B

 

[Welldunn]

New bike is home.

Old bike is on its way to a new home.

Life is good.