Heat Shield for the Air Box?

[UselessPickles]

While my air box is off the bike to put the finishing touches on my air box mod to allow more airflow, I thought it might be worthwhile to slap a heat shield on the front side of it to shield it from engine heat. More air is good. Cooler air is good. So more cooler air must be even better, right?

I don't know if it would really reduce the intake air temperature significantly (I hear that every 10 degrees Fahrenheit is about 1% power), but for just over $20, I might as well give it a try. Here's some reflective heat shield cloth with an adhesive backing that should be very easy to cut to size and apply to the air box: https://www.cbxmanmotorcycles.com/productin...051&affid=4

Does anyone know of any reason that this could cause anything undesirable to happen? It seems to me that the worst that could happen is that it has no effect, but there's also the chance that it could effectively shield a bit of heat and maybe gain a couple ponies.

If I decide that I don't mind taking my air box off the bike yet again, then I might be willing to get some actual air intake temperature measurements before and after the heat shield. I have a temperature sensor on its way to me that I plan to hook up to the extra analog input to my Motty AFR Tuner so I can log the air temperature while I ride

 

[UselessPickles]

Did I just post this at a bad time, or is there really no one with opinions about how this will cause my bike to explode?

 

[FJRay]

Did I just post this at a bad time, or is there really no one with opinions about how this will cause my bike to explode?

I don't think your bike will self destruct but I am sure that ODOT will tell you that your balls will. :yahoo:

 

[Bungie]

Wrap it in tinfoil and try it.

Their seems to be a few guys trying things in the quest for extra power. This, scoops in the side panels... WHY? I can only shake my head. Opening up the air box no doubt gains you a couple of hp at the top end. If you reprogram the ECU... thats a whole lot of work for basically a couple hp gain where it does no good at all. Nevermind the potential LOSS in the midrange where it's most needed, and the risk of reducing the weatherproofing of the stock system.

As one who had to cut a plastic pop bottle to put over his snorkle style intake because it started raining heavy just to get home... it's just not worth it.

But hey, your time, your money, your bike. Go nuts.

 

[odot]

Ray is always right. That heat will be deflected towards yer nether regions and certain pain will be felt whilst yer balls melt. Hope you enjoy your 0.0032 HP gain.

klown.

 

[dbracer23]

Go for it Pickles! I can't see any negative effects. At worst, no gain. I don't understand the need for guys on here to run people down just for looking for a few more horses. If you think your bike is fast enough, fine. Then don't cut your bike up. What's it to you if someone else wants more power and is willing to mod their bike to try to do so. I applaud guys like WickedWebby and UselessPickles who aren't satisfied with stock and will stick their necks out a little to find something better.

 

[Wicked Webby]

Thanks Dbracer23!

Pickles,

You know I like your quest for more HP. It is great!! Though, I am afraid this one may not be worth your time (or the dime). Not trying to sound like some naysayers of the past either.

Your assessment of hot air is pretty much on the money. Cold air is more dense than hot air. Thus, the colder the air (along with the increased appropriate amounts of fuel and lack of exhaust restrictions) has the ability to create more HP than it does with hot air. Yes, indeed!! :yahoo:

My thoughts are this. If the new heat shield (you introduce) traps hot air away from the air box.... This might be beneficial (though, the air box is already very contained away from engine heat). If this trap holds more heat around the engine... BAD!!!!

Don't forget that your Gen II FJR benefits from a very well designed heat reduction air system (already) setup to reduce over all heat away from the rider, engine alike.

If the placement of your heat shield deflects heat back at the motor... You might just created a higher temperature running system. Remember that these higher temps can make everything (else it touches.... engine, frame, gas tank, air box) hotter also.

Now, if you really want to introduce cold dense air into the intake there are ways.... Co and Nos of course!!

You know I am all about more Hp...

Let us know what kind of results you get.

WW

 

[v65]

has the ability to create more HP

But it may not. Back in the 80's Smokey Yunick designed an induction system that warmed the incoming air which created better atomization of the fuel, he got a lot of hp out of a little four banger that way. I know one way to find out if it will work - $.

 

[UselessPickles]

Wrap it in tinfoil and try it.
Their seems to be a few guys trying things in the quest for extra power. This, scoops in the side panels... WHY? I can only shake my head. Opening up the air box no doubt gains you a couple of hp at the top end. If you reprogram the ECU... thats a whole lot of work for basically a couple hp gain where it does no good at all. Nevermind the potential LOSS in the midrange where it's most needed, and the risk of reducing the weatherproofing of the stock system.

As one who had to cut a plastic pop bottle to put over his snorkle style intake because it started raining heavy just to get home... it's just not worth it.

But hey, your time, your money, your bike. Go nuts.

If you already have something in place like the Motty AFR Tuner to automatically adjust fueling to match AFR targets even if you change exhaust/intake (like I do), then spending an extra $15 and some time on modifying the air box is not a "whole lot of work". If you already have the air box off the bike to do this mod, then it's not a "whole lot of work" to also add a $25 heat shield for a couple more potential ponies.

You're also wrong on the hp gains/losses. There's actually quite a significant gain in the mid-range (4k-5k RPMs) as proven by Wicked Webby:

(lowest tq/hp graph is stock + Remus Hexacon slip-ons; highest graph is same bike with modded air box and adjusted fueling)

This air box stuff gives much better hp-per-$ than aftermarket slip-ons.

 

[mike25]

It should work fine, but use the good stuff.

https://www.hrpworld.com/index.cfm?tpt=HRP_...product_picture

 

[Bustanut joker]

Man thats an awfull lota work for a few xtra ponys... I'm gonna cut a hole in the top an toss a few ice cubes in the box..

Jes funnin pickles.

Hey next time you head over towards Lapeer to test your stuff let me know. I'll run on over and maybe see what this stocker can do.

:jester:

 

[UselessPickles]

has the ability to create more HP

But it may not. Back in the 80's Smokey Yunick designed an induction system that warmed the incoming air which created better atomization of the fuel, he got a lot of hp out of a little four banger that way.

I did a bit of searching around on Smokey Yunick's engine design. Looks like there's a lot more to it than just warming the air. The air needs to be warmed AFTER it gets sucked in through a check valve and some sort of turbine to prevent the expanding heated air from escaping back out the intake.

With a naturally aspirated engine, warmer air can only mean less air in the combustion chamber. Likewise, cooler air means more air in the combustion chamber. If this is matched with the correct amount of fuel (as my Motty will automatically take care of), then cooler air can only mean more combustion force.

I know one way to find out if it will work - $.

Since the price of admission on this one is only $25 and I have a way to record intake air temperature under varying conditions throughout a ride, I think I'll go through with it. If the results show increased air temperatures, I'll rip it off. If they show decreased air temperatures, then there's a benefit to having the heat shield. The overall power gains will be unknown because I won't be doing before/after dyno runs, but I've seen many sources estimate 1% power gains for every 5-10*F reduction.

 

[v65]

because I won't be doing before/after dyno runs

Hey that's cheating! So when are we going to see some dyno runs on this beast?

 

[Philip V]

Man I must be gettin old :dribble: My bike has more power than I know what to do with already. I couldn't imagine trying to eek out a wee bit more. :yahoo:

 

[Constant Mesh]

Probably no effect simply because the air moves through the box so rapidly. Air doesn't stay in the box long enough to absorb any heat except for when the engine's not running.

 

[UselessPickles]

because I won't be doing before/after dyno runs

Hey that's cheating! So when are we going to see some dyno runs on this beast?

Lol... if I had infinite time and money, I'd be doing dyno runs every step along the way. I am planning on a dyno session sometime this year after my bike is finished and after the initial break-in period. The main purpose of the session will be to determine the best AFR for max power. I'll then configure my Motty to target that AFR for 100% throttle and do a couple full throttle runs on the dyno to let the Motty make its adjustments and get a dyno chart with the Motty fully tuned for max power at 100% throttle.

Then when I post the dyno chart, people will whine about not having a baseline run of my bike in stock form on the same day and time with the same atmospheric conditions. Others might say that they want to see a baseline run with a "zero" fuel map to see how much improvement the Motty gave me, but that will be irrelevant because it's the combination of the intake/exhaust mods AND properly tuned fuel that gives the improvements and such a comparison would not be a valid measure of the effectiveness of the Motty.

I won't get an accurate measure of total performance gains, but I will still get to see changes in the overall shape of the torque curve, the RPMs at which peak HP and TQ occur, etc. That type of info can be directly compared to other dyno charts of stock FJRs. The actual reported numbers will still be meaningful as long as a certain amount of error is assumed.

I should start a poll for people to place bets on the peak HP

 

[UselessPickles]

Probably no effect simply because the air moves through the box so rapidly. Air doesn't stay in the box long enough to absorb any heat except for when the engine's not running.

I think it has a chance of being effective at lower throttle openings (cruising). The best chance for effectiveness is when slowing/stopping in traffic. Or when waiting in line or at the starting line of the drag strip

My plans to test insulating foam for blocking air pathways between the engine and the intake openings have a better chance of being effective under acceleration. Now that the sides are opened up wide without the little backward-facing funnel, the modded air box has a much better chance of sucking in hot air from the engine area. I should probably test the foam idea first, settle on the best results with that, then add the heat shield.

 

[blk_hole 2]

I am a little late getting to the party...don't cruse here enough.

I covered my air box,and intake horns (both) in in a very high quality thermal block,from work I call it satellite tape. (airospace stuff very expensve)

I also did inside the fairing infront of my shins,the crotch band,and by my calves. Been too much snow to ride yet.

I don't expect any bad side effects...heat control for the rider and a cooler intake charge.

Kevin

I have pictures don't know how to get them on here though. (don't have a photo host)

 

[Wicked Webby]

has the ability to create more HP

But it may not. Back in the 80's Smokey Yunick designed an induction system that warmed the incoming air which created better atomization of the fuel, he got a lot of hp out of a little four banger that way.

I did a bit of searching around on Smokey Yunick's engine design. Looks like there's a lot more to it than just warming the air. The air needs to be warmed AFTER it gets sucked in through a check valve and some sort of turbine to prevent the expanding heated air from escaping back out the intake.

With a naturally aspirated engine, warmer air can only mean less air in the combustion chamber. Likewise, cooler air means more air in the combustion chamber. If this is matched with the correct amount of fuel (as my Motty will automatically take care of), then cooler air can only mean more combustion force.

I know one way to find out if it will work - $.

Since the price of admission on this one is only $25 and I have a way to record intake air temperature under varying conditions throughout a ride, I think I'll go through with it. If the results show increased air temperatures, I'll rip it off. If they show decreased air temperatures, then there's a benefit to having the heat shield. The overall power gains will be unknown because I won't be doing before/after dyno runs, but I've seen many sources estimate 1% power gains for every 5-10*F reduction.

Pickles,

Very solid points on the differences of cold and not so cold air within naturally aspirated engines of course.

BTW, I like blkhole2's idea of wrapping/taping his intake tubes with that heat reflective stuff.

Pickles; you should consider this if your gonna do this mod. Also, if you can place that heat barrier in a way that doesn't

trap the heat back into the engine compartment (still allows for the hot air to escape, as designed by the factory)..

I say she might be worth a whirl.

Even better yet... Shield the front edges of your Wicked Webby Styled air box/filters (under the plastic below the seat)

and put some vents in like GypsyCaravan did here.

https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php?s...hl=wicked+webby

Now your pulling air from outside of the warm engine compartment!!

WW