Canada Border Crossing Question

[Spud]

Last October I gambled on the weather and took a late October trip to Glacier / Waterton. Got up to leave Lethbridge in the AM to head home and it was a blizzard. Hung out at the hotel until 11 then headed out. Went through flurries that were snowing but just not quite sticking to the road. Hit the border crossing at Del Bonita, out in the middle of nowhere, all alone. This place:

An agent walks out of the building and his first question was "what in the hell you doing out here on a motorcycle?" Tells me they've got a storm warning expecting 6" and I needed to keep moving south. Quickest crossing ever, he obviously knew i was way too stupid to be a smuggler lol...

 

[mikerider]

Also, don't leave anything on your phone that you don't want all the border agents to read. They could ask to make a complete copy of all the data on your phone if they want to.

 

[Uncle Hud]

mikerider posted: Also, don't leave anything on your phone that you don't want all the border agents to read. They could ask to make a complete copy of all the data on your phone if they want to.

I'm not an attorney, but I'd think a search warrant would be required to read the stuff on your phone, and a search warrant is predicated by probable cause. (I think.)

<edit, 5 mins later> From the ACLU website, discussing US Customs and Border Protection (CBP):

The government claims the authority to search all electronic devices at the border, no matter your legal status in the country or whether they have any reason to suspect that you’ve committed a crime. You can state that you don’t consent to such a search, but unfortunately this likely won’t prevent CBP from taking your phone.

If you’ve given Customs and Border Protection agents the password to your device (or if you don’t have one), they might conduct what’s often called a “cursory search” on the spot. They might also download the full contents of your device and save a copy of your data.

...........................................................................

I stand corrected. mikerider is right.

 

[MEM]

mikerider posted: Also, don't leave anything on your phone that you don't want all the border agents to read. They could ask to make a complete copy of all the data on your phone if they want to.

I'm not an attorney, but I'd think a search warrant would be required to read the stuff on your phone, and a search warrant is predicated by probable cause. (I think.)

From the ACLU website, discussing US Customs and Border Protection (CBP):

The government claims the authority to search all electronic devices at the border, no matter your legal status in the country or whether they have any reason to suspect that you’ve committed a crime. You can state that you don’t consent to such a search, but unfortunately this likely won’t prevent CBP from taking your phone.

If you’ve given Customs and Border Protection agents the password to your device (or if you don’t have one), they might conduct what’s often called a “cursory search” on the spot. They might also download the full contents of your device and save a copy of your data.

...........................................................................

I stand corrected. mikerider is right.

That's for us Canuckistanis going INto the US or y'all returning ... yes?? New as of a couple /few weeks ago

 

[NorCal FJR]

With all the good information I have received, I figured I would throw out my route for suggestions. California and Oregon are set unless there is a problem someone knows about (Hwy 5 for time). My biggest concern is trying to avoid the Seattle area, so based on George's advice I changed the route a little. Is cutting over on the 405 to the 9 better than taking Highway 5 past Seattle to highway 9?

https://goo.gl/maps/1nyFHe1zzZK2

Thanks again for all the information.

Rich

 

[Uncle Hud]

Yes, that's for the US border guards. You know, they're trying to keep us Americans safe.

 

[Uncle Hud]

MEM posted: That's for us Canuckistanis going INto the US or y'all returning ... yes?? New as of a couple /few weeks ago

Yes, that was quoted from the ACLU about the United States Customs and Border Protection folks. They don't care who LEAVES our country, only who tries to get in ... including US citizens that are returning.

Like I said earlier, I am not an attorney, I just quote sections of the internet.

 

[Spud]

I think the phone seizure or other serious intrusions would only occur if they really suspected you of drug trafficking. I've crossed the border probably 15 times each way in the last several years. 2 weeks ago going into CA and returning to the US, no vehicles in the line were pulled over for any search. At the Nelway crossing in eastern WA, I had to empty my bags and side cases going back into the US twice in a row. The second time was on a return from NAFO (?) in Castlegar. I was in between an active duty marine in front of me, and a retired state trooper behind me. We all got searched in early morning rain. Just the bad luck of a draw. The one thing they do look for is prescription meds in labelled bottles, in my experience.

I had dinner once with an FJR rider who's wife was a customs agent on the CA/US border. She told us quite a bit about how things go down, and said that once in a while they simply get an order from WA DC that says "search every vehicle for the next 30 minutes" or some other random instruction. She didn't like that part of her job too much as she got to know folks that cross over frequently and then out of the blue they're getting searched. So your random # can come up but almost always crossing is no big deal.

 

[mikerider]

It just could happen to anybody entering US. A few months ago. A US born NASA engineer's government phone was seized when returning to US in the airport.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2017/02/13/us/citizen-nasa-engineer-detained-at-border-trnd/index.html

 

[puppychow]

As with all things - YMMV on these border crossings. Better to err on the side of caution, and prudence - than not.

My experiences or anyone-else's may not transfer to you, as is, too many changing (knowns, unknowns, and unknown unknowns) variables. For example - I wasn't even asked to remove my flip-up helmet coming back into the USA, but my riding partners were. One of our riding partners had an expired passport and he had no trouble getting in and out etc etc... all of this is just anecdotal, which may be of little value, and not empirical enough for it to apply to anything other than that particular instance.

Having said that, if you are an upstanding citizen, are playing by the rules, and are not a smart-ass or a dick-wad, you "typically" should not have any trouble.

 

[Heen]

Rich,

Unless you enjoy slabbing it, there are much better roads to take in Washington. I use to live in NE Washinton and there are better roads to ride than HW 395 through Spokane to I-90. PM me if you are interested.

Neil

 

[FJRay]

With all the good information I have received, I figured I would throw out my route for suggestions. California and Oregon are set unless there is a problem someone knows about (Hwy 5 for time). My biggest concern is trying to avoid the Seattle area, so based on George's advice I changed the route a little. Is cutting over on the 405 to the 9 better than taking Highway 5 past Seattle to highway 9?
https://goo.gl/maps/1nyFHe1zzZK2

Thanks again for all the information.

Rich

If it were me I would totally avoid I5. now that hwy 97 is posted at 65 it's just as fast to stay east. You can follow 97 all the way to BC and have a much more enjoyable trip missing All the metro areas on I5. Just a thought.

 

[puppychow]

I would route though Peaceful Valley between Deming and Sumas. Much less traffic, and more scenic.

https://goo.gl/maps/tsGcmTGjn8F2

 

[RichDoyle]

With all the good information I have received, I figured I would throw out my route for suggestions. California and Oregon are set unless there is a problem someone knows about (Hwy 5 for time). My biggest concern is trying to avoid the Seattle area, so based on George's advice I changed the route a little. Is cutting over on the 405 to the 9 better than taking Highway 5 past Seattle to highway 9?
https://goo.gl/maps/1nyFHe1zzZK2

Thanks again for all the information.

Rich

405 has added screwy tolling stuff in what used to be a very useful (for MC's) HOV lane.

 

[RichDoyle]

I used to travel with some regularity into Canada, usually into Victoria, only a few times into Vancouver. But I haven't made that trip on the surface in at least 15 years. I probably have made no surface trips across the Canadian border since 9/11. Since that time things on the US side have continually tightened over the years.

Since 2001, mostly I would fly into Victoria, though I've also had occasion to fly into Boundary Bay, BC and London, ON. For airplanes there is now all manner of annoying extra paperwork required by the US. Canadian customs has been a complete non-factor, other than the formality of calling NAVCANADA telling them I'm coming, and calling on the phone when I arrive. Coming back to the US is a different story. I've never gotten hassled, really, but it is definitely inconvenient and time-consuming.

 

[JamesW]

I ride a loop going over the North Cascades Hwy then cross at Nighthawk and take the 3 - 1 back to Sumas almost every year in late September or early October. It's a great autumn foliage ride!I like using the duty free place coming back into Washington, no so much for the cheap booze but a lot of times there is a two or three mile back up so I ride the shoulder buy my jug and get back in line ten cars back from the crossing. I know, cheating but it's a real time saver.

Something for you IB guys to consider.

Do the same ride once or twice a year but Sumas early AM and than back nighthawk, loup-loup, N. Cascades. Got tired of pushing my ride in the long lines you mentioned.

 

[JamesW]

With all the good information I have received, I figured I would throw out my route for suggestions. California and Oregon are set unless there is a problem someone knows about (Hwy 5 for time). My biggest concern is trying to avoid the Seattle area, so based on George's advice I changed the route a little. Is cutting over on the 405 to the 9 better than taking Highway 5 past Seattle to highway 9?
https://goo.gl/maps/1nyFHe1zzZK2

Thanks again for all the information.

Rich

Time of day is crucial regardless of which, and 405 has a toll section(carpool/express lanes) from Bellevue North. Everything going N. is choked evenings with folks trying to get home. Starts early afternoons around 3ish and depending on accidents can go to 7 or so at nite. What is your projected time frame?

 

[JamesW]

Looking at your map, I would exit stage right at lakewood/parkland and take 512 to 167 and avoid the whole tacoma C/F. And not being an IB (like G.) Sacramento to Abbotsford is one long day. (how many miles?)

 

[NorCal FJR]

Looking at your map, I would exit stage right at lakewood/parkland and take 512 to 167 and avoid the whole tacoma C/F. And not being an IB (like G.) Sacramento to Abbotsford is one long day. (how many miles?)

I was wondering about that cut over, when I was looking at the map. If I do it all in one day it will be about 850 miles give or take a few.

 

[escapefjrtist]

Rich, you'll definitely need to consider the week day traffic in Seattle / surrounding areas. It sux...no better way to put it.

It's a long day no matter which way you come north. I hit the road from YFO at 4:45A and got home at 9:45P. Pushed pretty hard until I got through Portland and then loafed home, mainly to time the travel from Olympia north and miss most of the I-5 mess.

Alternate route up 97 would be a nice alternative to I-5 if you have the extra time.

--G