Wicked Webby Air Box Mod Warning

[Hit the Road Jack]

Yeah, I think you can pretty much rule out any future warranty claims service from either K&N or Yamaha!

Congratulations for showing your ass, and being proud of it!

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

In the history of internal combustion engines, in general, intake air-filtration has come to be treated very seriously -- once the 'hand-writing-on-the-wall' was clearly seen (oil analysis).

In the "good old days" of motorcycling, high-performance British sporting motorcycles often came with no air-filters at all and the more 'practical' models had just rudimentary "gravel strainers" -- and they (all) often/soon exhibited smokey exhaust and needed frequent engine re-building.

Good, precise, engine air-filtration is a 'good thing'....

 

[Toecutter]

Did a dyno yesterday and gained 4HP at peak and 5 pounds torque right in the middle of the RPM range. Lost power or torque nowhere. Cheapest (cost $0.00) and fastest (30 minute mod) power gain I have ever seen.

Doesn't this require a ~$300.00 tuning computer to make the fuel increase adjustment for the HP gain? Stock pipes?

 

[UselessPickles]

Though it is very much a flawed KnK filter verses a problem with the mod (as your thread title implies).

I would let KnN know about what happened to that filter.

Maybe they will have some insight on this for you(For example;

How have you been Cleaning them.. How much oil and what

kind have you been using... How'd that steel screen get damaged? Ect..)

BOTTOM LINE.... Flawed filter ,NOT a flawed setup.

I'll agree that it was a flawed filter, but I'm the one that introduced the flaw by flattening the screen. Bending the wire in the opposite direction that it had already been bent weakened it. All the junk it accumulated in only 4k miles created a bigger pressure differential (it clogged a bit), which caused more force to be applied to the weakened creases.

Maybe I was more forceful than you in flattening my filters and/or maybe I just live in a dirtier place that allows my filters to get clogged quicker. Or maybe I really did just get a weak section of screen from K&N, but it probably was within spec and would've been just fine as it was in its original form (pleated). Either way, K&N will just tell me that I didn't use their filter as designed/intended. I'm not willing to risk sending more aluminum screen into my engine, so I'm going back to an air filter that I know for a fact was designed to withstand the airflow forces of the FJR and provide adequate filtering.

 

[dcarver]

I recall a post from Radman or Jestal describing an engine head that 'windows' installed in order to view a variety of objects introduced into the carb. Interesting, random results followed.

FWIW, this FJR has only run OEM filters and look at this mess, approx 60k miles.

and these fotos are SkooterG's ride..

Full info here.

 

[Karl]

Did a dyno yesterday and gained 4HP at peak and 5 pounds torque right in the middle of the RPM range. Lost power or torque nowhere. Cheapest (cost $0.00) and fastest (30 minute mod) power gain I have ever seen.

Doesn't this require a ~$300.00 tuning computer to make the fuel increase adjustment for the HP gain? Stock pipes?

Did a dyno tuning link in April since the bike had been tuned prior in WA state. It did NOT like CA oxygenated gas. Had to richen it significantly from the WA map which makes sense because.........guess what? more oxygen in the fuel, less BTU to make things go. More filler, less killer. Re-mapped and now a happy bike again.

Fast forward a few months. Bored and need to farkle. Did the airbox mod and took it back to Richard to verify how things look. Ran for numbers prior to any adjust and that's where the gains showed up. As I mentioned prior, only needed to add a small amount of fuel down low at partial throttle, 100% throttle no change. Have had Remus carbon slip-ons for 4 years.

So bottom line? If a non-PC3/OEM exhaust bike did this would it work? I dont know. All I know is my bike liked it and so do I.

 

[Fred W]

So let me get this straight: You are claiming a 4 hp (3%) gain by comparing recently acquired dyno data to a run that was made a few months ago? I don't think I would trust the dyno data to be that reproduceable...

 

[johnny80s]

I'll agree that it was a flawed filter, but I'm the one that introduced the flaw by flattening the screen. Bending the wire in the opposite direction that it had already been bent weakened it.

This does not make sense.

 

[UselessPickles]

I'll agree that it was a flawed filter, but I'm the one that introduced the flaw by flattening the screen. Bending the wire in the opposite direction that it had already been bent weakened it.

This does not make sense.

Maybe I crammed too many ideas into one sentence. I'll split it up:

The wire mesh was already bent during the manufacturing process to create the pleats in the filter material. I flattened it. This involved straightening the bent wire mesh - bending it in the opposite direction of the original bend. Bending a wire back and forth at the same point weakens the wire at that point. The wire mesh tore along these flattened creases. Therefore, I concluded that the act of flattening the filter was a major contributor to the failure. I introduced a flaw to the filter that allowed it to fail.

 

[wheatonFJR]

clear.

 

[Karl]

So let me get this straight: You are claiming a 4 hp (3%) gain by comparing recently acquired dyno data to a run that was made a few months ago? I don't think I would trust the dyno data to be that reproduceable...

April (cool) for pre-mod #'s, Late July (hot) for post-mod #'s and SAE corrected on the same dyno. But you're right, the gains are probably not real.

 

[UselessPickles]

So let me get this straight: You are claiming a 4 hp (3%) gain by comparing recently acquired dyno data to a run that was made a few months ago? I don't think I would trust the dyno data to be that reproduceable...

April (cool) for pre-mod #'s, Late July (hot) for post-mod #'s and SAE corrected on the same dyno. But you're right, the gains are probably not real.

If both dyno runs were not done on the same dyno at the same time in parallel universes that are identical except for the mods on the bike, then the results are worthless.

Wicked Webby gained 3 hp just by cutting the funnel off the cover (same dyno, same day, I believe), so getting an additional 1 hp by cutting an extra hole in the air box too is quite reasonable.

 

[Karl]

So let me get this straight: You are claiming a 4 hp (3%) gain by comparing recently acquired dyno data to a run that was made a few months ago? I don't think I would trust the dyno data to be that reproduceable...

April (cool) for pre-mod #'s, Late July (hot) for post-mod #'s and SAE corrected on the same dyno. But you're right, the gains are probably not real.

If both dyno runs were not done on the same dyno at the same time in parallel universes that are identical except for the mods on the bike, then the results are worthless.

Wicked Webby gained 3 hp just by cutting the funnel off the cover (same dyno, same day, I believe), so getting an additional 1 hp by cutting an extra hole in the air box too is quite reasonable.

I know. I was patronizing him just for fun. Now I remember why I rarely visit or post on this FJR site. Always too much attitude, puffed up egos, and uber-moderated.

 

[johnny80s]

I'll agree that it was a flawed filter, but I'm the one that introduced the flaw by flattening the screen. Bending the wire in the opposite direction that it had already been bent weakened it.

This does not make sense.

Maybe I crammed too many ideas into one sentence. I'll split it up:

The wire mesh was already bent during the manufacturing process to create the pleats in the filter material. I flattened it. This involved straightening the bent wire mesh - bending it in the opposite direction of the original bend. Bending a wire back and forth at the same point weakens the wire at that point. The wire mesh tore along these flattened creases. Therefore, I concluded that the act of flattening the filter was a major contributor to the failure. I introduced a flaw to the filter that allowed it to fail.

I with you now.

 

[Fred W]

I know. I was patronizing him just for fun. Now I remember why I rarely visit or post on this FJR site. Always too much attitude, puffed up egos, and uber-moderated.

You seem to be the only one in this thread with an attitude and a puffed up ego.

I never said you didn't have any gains by chopping up your air box. I only said that I wouldn't trust the reproduceability of a dyno on 2 days several months apart to accurately gauge a variation of such a small (only 3%) change. Think about that for a second. It means that there is just as much of a chance that the gains were under reported as over.

 

[Big Shasta]

I would let KnN know about what happened to that filter. Maybe they will have some insight on this for you(For example;

How have you been Cleaning them.. How much oil and what

kind have you been using... How'd that steel screen get damaged? Ect..)

BOTTOM LINE.... Flawed filter ,NOT a flawed setup.

So your suggestion is...

Brrrring! Brrrrring!

Joe, the K&N Customer Service Rep: "Hello, this is Joe at K&N. How can I help you today?"

Useless Pickles: "Yeah, hey, Joe. I took one of your perfectly good filters, cut it up, flattened it and stuck on my bike's airbox (also cut up and modded) for use in a way never intended by either you or my bike's maker. For some strange reason, the screen on my now cut up and flattened filter broke and I think my bike sucked a piece into an intake &/or cylinder. I think your filter's flawed."

Joe, the K&N Customer Service Rep: :blink: "Right. You did what..?" :huh:

Maybe he should push for a warranty replacement while he's at it..?? :blink:

HA HA...exactly what I thought when I read that.....

Bottom line, those pleats serve a purpose and a flattened filter isn't filtering adequately.

 

[Skully]

Nice crud ya got in there. Your bike was like a ...beta?

 

[SkooterG]

I know. I was patronizing him just for fun. Now I remember why I rarely visit or post on this FJR site. Always too much attitude, puffed up egos, and uber-moderated.

WTF?!?!?!

 

[RadioHowie]

I know. I was patronizing him just for fun. Now I remember why I rarely visit or post on this FJR site. Always too much attitude, puffed up egos, and uber-moderated.

WTF?!?!?!

Skoot, you can do better than that. You still fatigued from the rescue?

 

[radman]

HA HA...exactly what I thought when I read that.....
Bottom line, those pleats serve a purpose and a flattened filter isn't filtering adequately.

Actually, the pleats are to increase filter area in a given space. Doubles the available media. For what it's worth, I've used a Uni since first available, my TB throttle plates are spotless. Something isn't right there.